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[00:13] <thumbs> rworkman: careful with that adaptr character. He's quirky.
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[00:15] <rworkman> Seems to be :)
[00:16] <thumbs> rworkman: He'll manage to do most things in slack, provided we give him hints.
[00:16] <XGizzmo> Is that a clue not to give hints?
[00:17] <rworkman> hehe
[00:17] <thumbs> part of me wants him to have a hard time, but I'd like him to keep using slackware.
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[00:18] <XGizzmo> As long as he is willing to work at it.
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[00:25] <techwonder> Hope someone can answer this...no luck in howto's, etc.  How many programs can you have running in the background using &? And if you can have more than one, how do you bring each back to the forground again?
[00:26] <drkstr> screen is your friend
[00:26] <vastina> drkstr: agreed, same with ion wm
[00:27] <techwonder> thx
[00:27] <vastina> techwonder: did you do a full install?
[00:27] <techwonder> yes
[00:28] <vastina> man screen
[00:28] <techwonder> just did, thx
[00:28] <mag0o> wind screen
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[00:28] <vastina> synonym of wind shield
[00:28] <techwonder> I'm trying to run ogg123, finch, and irssi in the same screen.
[00:28] <vastina> techwonder: man screen
[00:29] <techwonder> gotcha, thx
[00:29] <rworkman> techwonder: when you background something, you'll see a job number.  You can then do "fg <number>"
[00:29] <rworkman> (to bring that one back to the foreground)
[00:29] <techwonder> that sound easier, thx
[00:30] <vastina> $ screen -S <name>; ctrl+a+A <name>; ctrl+a+c <new screen instance>;
[00:31] <rworkman> screen(1) is better. :)
[00:31] <vastina> fg job from new window, run simultaneous shell as diagnostic
[00:31] <vastina> agreed
[00:31] <techwonder> I'll take a look at both and see which I like better
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[00:31] <vastina> i don't think techwonder gets it
[00:31] Action: vastina gives up
[00:33] <techwonder> still need to read up on screen but "fg <number>" seems easier, we'll see
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[00:34] <vastina> rworkman: ps(1)<args> | grep <args> <job name>; before fg ftw
[00:34] Nick change: neonflux_ -> neonflux
[00:35] <vastina> develops better habits imo
[00:35] <drkstr> at least with unix-like OSs there are multiple ways to kill any cat
[00:35] <vastina> "There's always more than one way to do it" ;)
[00:36] <vastina> but imo, there's often *more efficient* ways of doing it
[00:36] <drkstr> that is true
[00:37] <drkstr> but when you get paid by the hour, efficient isn't always the best path
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[00:37] <vastina> might equate to longevity and self sustainability; two nice catchwords for you
[00:37] <techwonder> don't think what I had in mind is going to work.  If the process sends something to the screen I'll need to send it to a file which would not serve in cases like irc...hmmm.
[00:38] <techwonder> screen might be it
[00:38] Action: vastina scratches head
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[00:39] <vastina> techwonder: i gave you a fantastic layman's example above, the advice would follow a read man; i'm confident screen will remedy your enquiry
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[00:41] Action: vastina wonders
[00:42] <vastina> i am in beer bliss
[00:42] <vastina> sed is entertaining
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[00:48] <acidchild> anyone know how to test if /dev/video is active?
[00:49] <acidchild> pumping out data of some sort.
[00:49] <drkstr> mplayer /dev/video
[00:49] <acidchild> no. this is alittle more deep than that drkstr =)
[00:49] <drkstr> although here it is /dev/video0
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[00:50] <acidchild> if i cat the device, nothing comes out.
[00:50] <drkstr> I would take that as it not being active then, not too deep.
[00:50] <acidchild> not true.
[00:50] <acidchild> =)
[00:51] <drkstr> you would know, obviously
[00:51] <acidchild> video0 on my desktop with no input, doesn't return 0 but on this davinci device, it does.
[00:52] <acidchild> exiting cat.
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[00:52] <acidchild> *confused*
[00:53] <drkstr> so what is the device?
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[00:54] <acidchild> DaVinci 64460000
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[00:54] <acidchild> says its a EVM board, but i think the company has built it from the ground up
[00:54] <acidchild> hence, going back to my question: (05:48) < acidchild> anyone know how to test if /dev/video is active?
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[00:55] <snL20> acidchild: lsof ?
[00:55] <acidchild> um. does lsof call /proc?
[00:56] Action: acidchild googles how lsof works
[00:56] <mancha> it call's 1-800-555-PROC
[00:56] <snL20> mancha: lol
[00:56] Action: acidchild callz
[00:56] <shonudo> lol
[00:57] <snL20> acidchild: not -PROST PROC
[00:57] <snL20> :D
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[00:57] <acidchild> lol, lame i'm gonna have to read source -.-
[00:58] <acidchild> http://cpan.perl.org/authors/id/J/JA/JAMSHAID/scripts/lsof-1.2.pl
[00:59] <slackin> <3 <3 <3
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[01:01] <Aweso> hello #slackware :)  i just have a question, if i want to sell PC's that i make, and i offer Slackware installed as a free and seperate service -- does that violate the terms of the usage license?
[01:01] <rworkman> no
[01:01] <urthwrm_> acidchild: Moar warnings / use strict pls
[01:02] <acidchild> urthwrm_: what
[01:02] <acidchild> the fuck
[01:02] <XGizzmo> And we are not the ones to ask if you are unsure.
[01:02] <acidchild> are you talking about?
[01:02] <Aweso> rworkman: thanks.
[01:02] <urthwrm_> acidchild: Heh, nevermind :)
[01:02] <acidchild> rworkman: even if he provides source and doesnt charge for the software?
[01:02] <acidchild> urthwrm_: i didn't write that script.
[01:02] <rworkman> Aweso: as long as you provide a copy of the sources upon request, you're fine.
[01:03] <urthwrm_> acidchild: hence why i said, nevermind
[01:03] <acidchild> use warnings; use strict; ;]
[01:03] <Aweso> does that include burned iso's?
[01:03] <Aweso> (used to install)
[01:03] <acidchild> Aweso: Dell sells computers with Ubuntu installed.
[01:03] <acidchild> i think you will be alrite ;
[01:03] <rworkman> Aweso: yes.  Include the sources, or include a written offer to provide them upon request.  It's easiest to just include a copy of them.
[01:03] <Aweso> oh, cool :)
[01:04] <Aweso> rworkman: yeah i was planning on giving them the disc's used to install, each time.
[01:04] <acidchild> rworkman: how you doing?
[01:04] <rworkman> Aweso: while there's no requirement that you do this, *if* you make money from Slackware, then it's nice to contribute some back to its development.
[01:04] <Aweso> with the passwords in the sleeve insert, kind of deal.
[01:04] <rworkman> acidchild: nice :)
[01:04] <acidchild> rworkman: yeah? hows the wife?
[01:04] <rworkman> acidchild: well, for the most part.  You?
[01:04] <acidchild> and the new commer..
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[01:05] <rworkman> Well, she's almost four months along now.
[01:05] <Aweso> rworkman: that is kind of what i am thinking, i was thinking 5% monthly sales as a donation to slack (maybe i'll even make enough to subscribe to the CD set in the store, hehe)
[01:05] <acidchild> ahh, i'm good. really frustrated at what i'm working on, so much legal crap blocking me... kinda related to Aweso's question... but... these guys are legal sharks and know how to go around the licences.
[01:05] <rworkman> ick
[01:05] <rworkman> Aweso: cool.  We'd appreciate it :)
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[01:06] <acidchild> yeah man, montavist. i would like them to die.
[01:06] <Aweso> bummer acidchild, sorry to stir up badness
[01:06] <acidchild> i dunno if you can hook that up?
[01:06] <rworkman> Montavista?  Isn't that where... hrm... what's his name.  Some high profile security guy... works?
[01:06] <Aweso> is that the A Hicks from the slackbook?
[01:06] <rworkman> Aweso: Alan_Hicks ?  yes.
[01:07] <acidchild> rworkman: i dunno, maybe... regardless they are lawyers that abuse GPL/GNU
[01:07] <Aweso> wow..
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[01:07] <acidchild> just abuse the opensource community.
[01:07] <acidchild> in general.
[01:07] <Aweso> i read that book all the time
[01:07] <acidchild> Aweso: yeah, he's our coffee bitch.
[01:07] <rworkman> acidchild: maybe I'm thinking of somewhere else.  I was thinking that Montavista does embedded devel and some "high profile" name is associated with them :/
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[01:08] <acidchild> rworkman: yeah, its ARM stuff
[01:08] <rworkman> ah yes
[01:08] <acidchild> rworkman: its a video encoding device...
[01:08] <Aweso> that is so cool :D
[01:08] <rworkman> Aweso: alan?  Nah, he's small shit.  ;-)
[01:08] <acidchild> Aweso: slap him for that
[01:08] <rworkman> Fun to drink with though :)
[01:09] <Aweso> nah he probably knows slackboy pretty well ;)
[01:09] <rworkman> Alan's hilarious when he's drunk.
[01:09] <Aweso> funny drunks are good
[01:09] <acidchild> :)
[01:09] <dchmelik> i thought slackboy is a bot
[01:09] <drkstr> better than violent drunks
[01:09] <acidchild> dchmelik you sleeping with drkstr?
[01:09] <rworkman> Well, he's pretty hilarious all the time, but especially so when he's drunk.
[01:09] <acidchild> rworkman has a boy crush
[01:10] <slackwarebob> rworkman? crush? what's the conspiracy?
[01:10] <drkstr> acidchild: sorry I couldn't help you, I just returned from the pub and I am quite drunk, no need to insult dchmelik
[01:10] Action: rworkman thinks acidchild is smoking stale dogshit or something.
[01:11] Action: acidchild bought it off rworkman
[01:11] <acidchild> you said it was pot!
[01:11] <rworkman> bwaahhahaha
[01:11] <Aweso> i just finished a bowl...
[01:11] <rworkman> of stale dogshit?
[01:12] <Aweso> well.. it was kind of old and dry, i found it cleaning...
[01:12] <drkstr> depends on what the dog ate
[01:12] <Aweso> i mean, who hasn't found an old bag of weed months later?
[01:12] <Aweso> i know i have.
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[01:13] <acidchild> Aweso: ah the best kind of pot.
[01:13] <Aweso> still did what i bought it for. :D
[01:13] <drkstr> one hit and the joint turns brown is one of the best kinds
[01:13] <Aweso> lol
[01:13] <Aweso> i like my zong...
[01:14] <acidchild> just means it has a high sugar content.
[01:14] <acidchild> white ash = clean flush and cure
[01:14] <rworkman> For grins and giggles: http://verydemotivational.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/129039390345477450.jpg
[01:14] <acidchild> SFW?
[01:14] <dchmelik> you guys should go to the offtopic channel....
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[01:15] <draeath> are kernels replaced in mirror/slackware-13.0/kernels or do they get placed somewhere else when an update is released?
[01:15] <Aweso> depends on what kind of W you do, acidchild
[01:16] <dchmelik> draeath, i think it would be slackware-current
[01:16] <acidchild> i know sugar content (tar when burnt) depends on strain.
[01:17] <acidchild> http://slackadelic.com/~ash/IMAGE_149.jpg
[01:17] <draeath> trying to figure out how to get slackware on this thing. the 13.0 installer kernels don't boot, they just hang after loading the initrd
[01:17] <acidchild> got a mega nerd setup going on in the living room atm
[01:17] <draeath> any ideas?
[01:17] <acidchild> ^_^
[01:17] <draeath> forbidden acidchild :P
[01:17] <acidchild> haha nice.
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[01:17] <Aweso> yeah, doesnt work
[01:18] <acidchild> ever conidered compiling your own?
[01:18] <rworkman> acidchild: yes, it's SFW.  (sorry for the delay)
[01:18] <draeath> well, yes, but how do I get the installer running from it?
[01:18] <draeath> the installer on CD is in the initrd right?
[01:18] <draeath> besides i don't know what the issue is, only that this BIOS is buggy crap
[01:19] <acidchild> Aweso: draeath should work now :-P
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[01:19] <acidchild> my umask was secure! zomg
[01:19] <acidchild> draeath: installer? as in
[01:19] <acidchild> pkgtool  ?
[01:20] <draeath> as in boot from the 13.0 CD and your at a prompt. you partition, then run "setup"
[01:20] <acidchild> okey, so thats called 'pkgtool' you can run that when ever, from cd or from just the host install.
[01:21] <acidchild> installpkg/removepkg are tools that are run from pkgtool to install/remove packages.
[01:21] <rworkman> http://verydemotivational.com/2009/12/08/i-got-it/  :)
[01:21] <acidchild> whats the error when booting? just freezing or some kind of kernel panic.
[01:21] <rworkman> SFW and SFG :)
[01:21] <draeath> setup isn't pkgtool
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[01:21] <draeath> anyways i need to get a booting kernel first
[01:22] <draeath> someone just now told me its apparently a fixable issue. need to flash :/
[01:22] <acidchild> uh, ok....
[01:22] <Aweso> draeath:  did you burn your iso's yourself?
[01:22] <acidchild> rworkman: lol nice!
[01:23] <draeath> its not a corruption issue. yea just confirmed, my BIOS revision is a buggy POS.
[01:23] <draeath> so all my issues are null and void till i get that flashed
[01:23] <acidchild> mmm if you say so, i bet there is a work around :-P
[01:23] <acidchild> draeath: other versions of linux dont work on that computer?
[01:23] <mancha> everyone always blames the bios  :)
[01:24] <acidchild> you know the livecd boots a kernel right? a kernel you can use daily also :P
[01:24] <Aweso> draeath: sorry just asking, because i just downloaded an iso and the md5 was off, so i thought i'd offer that idea.
[01:24] <draeath> acidchild: its hit or miss. bsd has some wierd issues under it too - plug in a usb mouse, and bang, instant lockup
[01:24] <acidchild> draeath: hit and miss? what distros have worked?
[01:25] <acidchild> because linux is linux!
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[01:25] <draeath> debian works. slackware doesn't. system rescue cd doesn't
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[01:25] <draeath> fedora doesn't
[01:26] <draeath> they all do the same thing - load the initrd, say "ready." and die
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[01:26] <acidchild> wurd.
[01:26] <Aweso> what kind of system is this?
[01:26] <acidchild> Aweso: see the picture? thats one of the bullet proof laptops on the desk
[01:26] <acidchild> :D
[01:27] <acidchild> i got it a few days ago
[01:27] <adaptr> acidchild: /proc is not a procedure, what do you mean by "call"
[01:27] <adaptr> darnit!
[01:28] <adaptr> irssi should really tell me when I'm 25 screens behind
[01:28] <Aweso> acidchild: is the desk glass?
[01:28] <acidchild> Aweso: oh, its just my front room, its a coffee table.
[01:28] <acidchild> adaptr: mmm hehe its alrite. sorry what are you reffering to.
[01:29] <Aweso> oh, i was going to say, sweet desk!  but... nope.  (which one is it, the small one?)
[01:29] <adaptr> never mind, it was half an hour ago
[01:29] <acidchild> adaptr: snL20 suggested using lsof to see if /dev/video0 has any related processes etc... as in it being active, i'm trying to see how to test if /dev/video0 is active but has no streaming data... or its just broken (at driver level)
[01:29] <acidchild> Aweso: right hand side of the glass coffee table.
[01:30] <Aweso> acidchild: thanks :)
[01:30] <Aweso> acidchild: so i could shoot that with a gun and it would still function?
[01:30] <acidchild> yep
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[01:31] <acidchild> well so they say, i could run it over thats for sure.
[01:31] <Aweso> wow, it's slackware in physical form....
[01:31] <adaptr> acidchild: I'm not aware at which point data leaves the pseudo-filesystem and enters the physical bus device, but it'd be a fair bet that it happens somewhere in the VFS/block node code, where it gets handed off to driver-specific functions
[01:31] <acidchild> adaptr: yeah... the problem is i can't transfer any files on to the device... to do any tests. say for example lsof.
[01:32] <acidchild> adaptr: its a very super stripped down version of linux.
[01:32] <adaptr> well if it's a read-only device this will be difficult in any case
[01:33] <acidchild> it has some jff and its all NAND stuff.. i'm having issues cross compiling anything for it.
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[01:41] <Aweso> quick poll: 128mb ram, 16mb video -- slackware with xfce.  yay or nay?
[01:41] <acidchild> yay
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[01:42] <Aweso> :)
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[01:56] <Aweso> acidchild: what about the same ram/vid, but with KDE?
[01:56] <acidchild> nope
[01:56] <acidchild> Aweso: tried fluxbox?
[01:56] <acidchild> :-) tis good stuff
[01:56] <Aweso> i've tried it a couple times
[01:57] <Aweso> i always end up back at kde or xfce for some reason..
[01:59] <toastytoast> youn tried lxde?
[01:59] <Aweso> does open office work regardless of window manager?
[01:59] <Aweso> lxde? no
[02:00] <toastytoast> yeah why would it open office rely on a wm
[02:00] <toastytoast> http://lxde.org/ it might be worth a look more light weight than kde or xfce
[02:00] <Aweso> i was just thinking resources wise, openoffice is a lot of awesome..
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[02:01] <Delahunt> openoffice works regardless of WM/DE
[02:01] <dchmelik> kde 3.5 is best
[02:01] <Delahunt> why would WM/DE matter?
[02:01] <Delahunt> kde apps work on other WMs/DEs also
[02:01] <Aweso> that is good to know, i've only ever used it in kde, i am never in another wm to use it..
[02:01] <Rat409> fwiw rxvt-unicode 9.07 was out dec30th http://dist.schmorp.de/rxvt-unicode/rxvt-unicode-9.07.tar.bz2
[02:01] <Aweso> another wm long enough*
[02:01] <macman_> hi all .. if i do a lame --decode *.mp3 *.wav .. will that change all mp3's to wave each song or will it do one mass change ?
[02:02] <Delahunt> macman_, it will not
[02:02] <Delahunt> iirc it's one file at a time
[02:02] <Delahunt> (i.e. INTO one file at a time)
[02:02] <toastytoast> any apps will run under other wm or atleast modst
[02:02] <toastytoast> like i can run lxlauncher in fluxbox
[02:02] <toastytoast> or lxpanel etc.
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[02:02] <Delahunt> so you need to do something like for i in *.mp3; do lame --decode $1; done
[02:02] <Delahunt> i think it knows to automatically converto to .wav
[02:02] <Delahunt> if not:
[02:03] <Delahunt> for i in *.mp3; do lame --decode $i $i.wav; done
[02:03] <Delahunt> hold on let me get some better stuff
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[02:03] <macman_> cool thanks Delahunt
[02:04] <toastytoast> couldn't you sue somthign like find -type -f -name '*.mp3' -exec lame --decode {} \;
[02:04] <toastytoast> use*
[02:04] <Delahunt> for i in *.mp3; do lame --decode $i ${i%.*}.wav; done
[02:04] <Delahunt> i think you need to specify out file for that (hold on)
[02:04] <macman_> ok
[02:05] <Delahunt> yeah i think you need to specify out file
[02:05] <Delahunt> be sure you test it first:
[02:05] <Delahunt> for i in *.mp3; do echo lame --decode $i ${i%.*}.wav; done
[02:05] <macman_> do that Delahunt  ?
[02:05] <Delahunt> make sure you look at the output and check that the command syntax outputs properly
[02:06] <Delahunt> if the intput and output files have spaces, you will need to surround stuff with \", like so:
[02:06] <Delahunt> for i in *.mp3; do lame --decode \"$i\" \"${i%.*}.wav\"; done
[02:07] <Delahunt> that way the in and out file get "" put around them
[02:07] <Delahunt> but always test before you run the command (like by inserting "echo" in front of lame to look at the output commands it will generate)
[02:08] <macman_> they are still mp3's Delahunt
[02:09] <macman_> ok hold on
[02:12] <Aweso> well, time for me to go, have a new vm i want to set up.  thanks rworkman, acidchild, toastytoast and Delahunt.  :)
[02:14] <macman_> how do i do a batch of mp3 to wav .. the for commands won't work
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[02:15] <Delahunt> macman_, are these all in separate directories or in one directory?
[02:15] <macman_> 1 directory
[02:16] <Delahunt> and you're IN the directory where they are located?
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[02:17] <macman_> yes
[02:17] <Delahunt> ok, try:
[02:17] <toastytoast> https://wonderland.dev.java.net/index.html that looks cool
[02:17] <Delahunt> for i in *.mp3; do lame --decode $i $i.wav
[02:17] <Delahunt> ; done
[02:18] <Delahunt> macman_, why are you converting them to wav btw?
[02:18] <macman_> Delahunt, i was told that wav are better for the car .. for sure to get done
[02:19] <Delahunt> uh, better for the car? what?
[02:19] <Delahunt> how do you play music in your car?
[02:20] <Delahunt> that advice makes absolutely no sense at all
[02:20] <macman_> i normally burn my audio cd's with mp3's .. a lot of people told me to convert them to wav
[02:21] <toastytoast> i useaulyl use pacpl for audio converting audio
[02:21] <macman_> something about it is better for the car / will play in any audio/cd player
[02:21] <Delahunt> toastytoast, congratulations you forgot about sox
[02:22] <Delahunt> macman_, that advice makes absolutely no sense at all.  first off, is your player able to play MP3 CDs?  or burned CDs?
[02:22] <Delahunt> second, you cannot increase the quality of something that has already lost information.  if the mp3 is 128 or 160 bit or whatever and you think converting it to wav will bring an increase in quality, you are incorrect
[02:22] <macman_> Delahunt, yes the car can .. Delahunt  most of the time i make audio cd's they won't play in the car for some reason .. i burn at a low speed
[02:23] <Delahunt> but can the car read burned audio CDs?
[02:23] <Delahunt> some say MP3 but not CD-R (the media format issues are confusing, but still, i have to ask)
[02:23] <Delahunt> ok so audio CDs won't burn
[02:23] <Delahunt> if the player can read MP3s then MP3s are better
[02:24] <urthwrm_> macman_: You may want to check the cd's your burning on. I've found that some cheaper cd's ive bought to burn on wont play in my car
[02:24] <Delahunt> when you make audio CDs are you making a CD full of MP3s or are you making an audio CD that is audio format?
[02:24] Action: Delahunt sighs
[02:24] <Delahunt> macman_, ok, tell me what player you have in your car: brand and model please
[02:24] <toastytoast> well Delahunt if anythgin i think pacpl is more like a cli front end cuz it uses ffmpeg lame twolame etc. i'm not entirly wue tho i guess
[02:24] <Delahunt> toastytoast, did he ask for one that is more of a cli front end?  have you ever used sox?  do you even know what his problem is or how to fix it?
[02:25] <Delahunt> so far he's not being clear to the problem so i'm now asking him what his player is so i can sort his issue(s) out
[02:25] <toastytoast> fromw aht i can gather he is trying to converyt mp3s to wav whihc can be accomlished quickly and easily with pacpl
[02:25] Action: Delahunt waits for macman_ to tell him what audio player he has in his car
[02:25] <Delahunt> yes but the advice he was given sounds totally retarded.  i think someone told him something incorrect.
[02:25] <toastytoast> the reason he is doing it
[02:25] <toastytoast> is becasue he was told wav was better
[02:25] <snL20> Delahunt: prolly an 8-track
[02:26] <snL20> >=)
[02:26] <Delahunt> better yes but in what way?
[02:26] <toastytoast> but i know what he is asking how to do
[02:26] <Delahunt> i'm digging deeper to figure out the root of the problem
[02:26] <toastytoast> and once again pacpl can quickly and easliy accomplish the task he wants done
[02:26] <Delahunt> if we help him convert mp3 to wav and that doesn't fix the problem he just wasted time
[02:26] <toastytoast> i beleive he is doing it also form jsut reading what he has posted
[02:27] <macman_> Delahunt, i don't know .. im in the house 0_o
[02:27] <toastytoast> becasue he was told that wav was more x-platfomr compatble
[02:27] <Delahunt> macman_, please go get it for me please
[02:27] <toastytoast> thats what i gather he was told having audio in wave would allow to be played on a wider variety of media players/portble music players
[02:28] <Delahunt> but if his mplayer says it plays mp3s putting them in wav is silly
[02:28] <toastytoast> i know it is but in that case
[02:28] <toastytoast> you could still inform him how to do it
[02:28] <toastytoast> and then
[02:28] <toastytoast> tell him its a silly idea
[02:28] <toastytoast> or do it alla t the same time
[02:29] <Delahunt> but someone simply telling him wav is better sounds like the ignorant advice you get at some retail stores
[02:29] <Delahunt> and i don't know about you but i'm not going to give him snake oil salesman advice
[02:29] <toastytoast> no no no
[02:29] <toastytoast> i beleive what he was told
[02:29] <toastytoast> as i have stated before
[02:30] <toastytoast> is that wav works on a wider varity of portable music palyers
[02:30] <Delahunt> but i've yet to find a player that doesn't play mp3s from LAME either
[02:30] <toastytoast> whihc is why he is trying to convert mp3 to wave
[02:30] <toastytoast> i know so as i said
[02:30] <toastytoast> tell him its a silly request
[02:30] <toastytoast> but if he stillw ants to know how
[02:30] <toastytoast> tell him the quickest easiet most effective way to do that
[02:31] <toastytoast> for my i feel that that is pacpl
[02:31] <Delahunt> but fwiw sox does it as well as lame
[02:31] <Delahunt> so either way when he's got two tools to do something, recommending yet another that he has to go download and compile is not very helpful
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[02:33] <toastytoast> there are slackware packages on the poacpl site they work well enough and i knwo sox and such can do it but is till like pacpl in this case i'm baised
[02:33] <Delahunt> yeah you, not him, like pacpl
[02:33] <toastytoast> plus i find using papcl for large amount of music converter at same time
[02:33] <toastytoast> i know this i said iw as biased to an extend
[02:34] <toastytoast> don't tell emw hat i've already told you
[02:34] <toastytoast> it gets annoying being told somethign you jsut said
[02:35] <toastytoast> but runing pacpl -r -p -t wav directoryname/ --outdir other directory name seems easier than doing it one at a time altho i am not fluent in using sox so i do not know if it is as easy to accomplish the same feat with it
[02:35] <Delahunt> if his player plays mp3s he's wasting his time converting to wav and should check his compile options
[02:35] <Delahunt> er check his cd burn option
[02:35] <toastytoast> you've already said that
[02:36] <toastytoast> and ia gree with you
[02:36] <toastytoast> doesn't mean we can't let hime no how to do it tho
[02:36] <Delahunt> it's stilly to burn a cd full of wav files
[02:36] <toastytoast> the more knowledge on ahs usueally the better off they are
[02:36] <Delahunt> "we"?
[02:36] <toastytoast> we as in everyone
[02:36] <Delahunt> i'm not "we" or "everyone"
[02:36] <Delahunt> i am helping him how i feel i ought to.  stay out of my way.
[02:37] <toastytoast> if some one is requestng knowledge and it is in the powers of someone to give them said knowledge i don't see why they shoudln't or wouldn
[02:37] <toastytoast> well then do liekwise
[02:37] <toastytoast> i recomend pacpl
[02:37] <toastytoast> if you don't liek it then don't bitch about it
[02:37] <toastytoast> this whole argument coudl ahve been aviod had you done jsut that
[02:38] <Delahunt> there's no argument
[02:38] <toastytoast> ok heated discussion
[02:38] <Delahunt> you're just plugging a program and trying to act like you're high above everything
[02:38] <toastytoast> no
[02:38] <toastytoast> i am recomending a program
[02:38] <toastytoast> and you aheva problemw itht hat
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[02:38] <toastytoast> if anythign you are the oen witha  supirioty complex
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[02:39] <Delahunt> you're good at arguing but not at facts
[02:39] <Delahunt> i am digging below the request to try to actually help him
[02:39] <toastytoast> i said you are free to do that
[02:39] <Delahunt> when he uses your program and the wav files don't make the problem better, he'll probably never use the program again and only get more frustrated
[02:39] <toastytoast> i was simply answer his quesiton of how to do it
[02:40] <Delahunt> why do you have to say i am free to do that?  this is my life.  i don't remember installing you as my decision proxy
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[02:40] <toastytoast> heh i don't care what you dow ith your life but i expect you to let me do with what i will with mine own
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[02:41] <Delahunt> you did.  you recommended the program.  why are you still talking if you did what you came to do?  8-)
[02:41] <toastytoast> am i not alowed to recomend a program i never siad anyone ahd to sue it
[02:41] <toastytoast> use*
[02:42] <Delahunt> ?
[02:42] <Delahunt> you are allowed to recommend a program
[02:42] <Delahunt> and you did ask him to use it
[02:42] <Delahunt> no irc clients were harmed during the making of your film 8-)
[02:43] <toastytoast> no i beleive i said i recomned using pacpl and i useually use it
[02:43] <toastytoast> and that i found it easy to use
[02:43] <hiptobecubic> There is some mega spam going on over in ##linux, just a heads up
[02:43] <Delahunt> hiptobecubic, ##freenode
[02:43] <Delahunt> (i think)
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[02:58] <Rat409> #freenode iirc
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[03:03] <fire|bird> y0 Rat409, how's it going?
[03:04] <fire|bird> and yes, it's #freenode
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[03:06] <spook> stupid question, how can i clear my mysql tables/users?
[03:06] <rworkman> http://xkcd.com/327/
[03:06] <Xeliaa> well you can use tools like the super ugly Mysql Workbench...
[03:07] <Xeliaa> or use something simpler like HeidiSQL
[03:07] <spook> i kinda have misplaced the mysql root user's password...
[03:07] <askhader> When attempting to run mysqladmin -u root -p create mailsql - I get the follwoing error: 'Access denied for user 'root'@'localhost' (using password: YES)' but I'm certain the password is correct
[03:07] <askhader> Any ideas?
[03:07] <Delahunt> rworkman, hehe
[03:07] <spook> askhader: you know that the mysql root user is different from the system root user, right?
[03:07] <askhader> spook: Yes
[03:08] <askhader> And I just re-set the root password
[03:08] <Delahunt> is blag a blog that is very blah?  8-S
[03:08] <askhader> The mysql root user password
[03:08] <askhader> Delahunt: That would be blagh
[03:08] <Xeliaa> did you uyse any chars like !?
[03:08] <askhader> >.>
[03:08] <askhader> No.;
[03:08] <Xeliaa> k cause doing it via command line it gets all wierd
[03:09] <askhader> I logged into mysql and set it myself
[03:09] <Xeliaa> did you remove the host access to localhost?
[03:09] <spook> urk, whats the proper/default permissions for /tmp ?
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[03:10] <spook> Delahunt: blag = xkcd slang for blog
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[03:10] <rworkman> btw, this is awesome. http://xkcd.com/681/
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[03:13] <spook> askhader: having the same problem :P
[03:13] <askhader> spook: Really? No shit
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[03:14] <askhader> spook: Are you trying to set up a mailserver?
[03:14] <spook> askhader: no just trying to setup mysql :S
[03:14] <askhader> lol
[03:14] <spook> i have this funny feeling i've already set it up, but none of the passwords it should be are correct
[03:15] <askhader> I went in and recovered the password
[03:15] <askhader> So I'm certain my password is correct
[03:15] <antiwire> You must get as drunk as you were when you initially set it up, again. Then you will remember the passwords.
[03:16] <Delahunt> lol
[03:16] <spook> :(
[03:17] <askhader> spook: http://www.cyberciti.biz/tips/recover-mysql-root-password.html
[03:18] <Xeliaa> well... you could shut down the mysql and delete the mysql db and reset it up
[03:18] <Xeliaa> course.. if you hadalot of users on it....
[03:19] <spook> it was unused.
[03:19] <Xeliaa> i just got done setting up new mysql installation, trying to make a lampp style thing using hiawatha
[03:20] <askhader> Xeliaa: Do you know the command to list the contents of a table?
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[03:20] <Xeliaa> like the actual data?
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[03:21] <askhader> Xeliaa: I just want to display the user table
[03:21] <askhader> I already did use mysql;
[03:21] <askhader> DESC user; ?
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[03:23] <askhader> Xeliaa: How can I delete the mysql db and get a fresh slate?
[03:24] <spook> even after i reset the password it still doesnt work :S
[03:24] <Xeliaa> well shut down the server, go to the /mysql/data directory
[03:24] <Xeliaa> inside you'll see a list of databases there formed up as directories
[03:25] <Xeliaa> delete the mysql or the contents inside
[03:25] <Xeliaa> then rerun the steps like from the begining.
[03:25] <spook> Xeliaa: you mean /var/lib/mysql obviously
[03:25] <spook> and i've already tried that
[03:25] <Xeliaa> where ever you installed mysql.
[03:26] <Xeliaa> beneath its main directory will be bin/ data/ var/ ect
[03:26] <spook> Xeliaa: you understand that slackware has a mysql package, right?
[03:26] <Xeliaa> yes i never use it
[03:26] <Xeliaa> i prefer to compile it by hand
[03:27] <spook> well your advice isnt all that helpful then.
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[03:27] <Xeliaa> well perhaps not. but you need to know where mysql sets the db's at
[03:28] <Xeliaa> sec i'll tagthe mysql packages and disect it....
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[03:29] <spook> Xeliaa: dont bother, i'll continue nutting this on my own
[03:30] <Rat409> hey fire|bird sorry was editing some configs,good thanks ,and yourself?
[03:30] <Xeliaa> technically you can just run mysql_install_db it may reinstall the database to defaults
[03:31] <spook> Xeliaa: it fails if you havent wiped /var/lib/mysql/ first.
[03:32] <fire|bird> Rat409: doing great, thank you. :)
[03:32] <Xeliaa> spook: if its default package you can just reinstall it via the package manager that will overwrite it all
[03:32] <Xeliaa> a quick solution if you havent done anything to the db other then change password.
[03:34] <Xeliaa> dont need to use the pakage one too, ya can also grab the latest stable from mysql.com and there's already pre-compiled binaries which you can unpack where you want and run
[03:34] <spook> Xeliaa: tried that too.  reinstall, remove + install   no dice.
[03:34] <spook> Xeliaa: i've tried the obvious, i'm far from clueless.
[03:35] <spook> Xeliaa: and i'm not doing it your way, which is messy.
[03:35] <Xeliaa> you can have more then one mysql on the server as long as you use ports
[03:36] <spook> fixed.
[03:36] <Xeliaa> my way isnt messy, fairly clean when you go by ./configure --prefix=/usr/local places it all in one dir. its the default install
[03:37] <spook> you're really just making my point for me.
[03:37] <Xeliaa> haha ok i was just offering help dont need to begin raking me down for helping.
[03:38] <Xeliaa> i just do everything by source rather then packages.
[03:38] <Xeliaa> and i place them all neatly in to specific directories like /srv or /opt that way i dont have to go hunting.
[03:39] <spook> Xeliaa: i dont, and it wasnt going to make any difference.  the problem was the line that said to use mysqladmin to set the root password when i ran mysql_install_db scrolled off the top of the screen and i missed it
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[03:39] <spook> Xeliaa: i use the package system so i can just look in /var/log/packages
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[03:42] <Xeliaa> hmm usr/doc/mysql-5.0.84/Docs/INSTALL-BINARY has some instructions as well.
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[03:44] <Xeliaa> now if i can find my glasses i can see what im reading thru >.<
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[03:49] <Rat409> night guys ya'll be well! later
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[05:56] <alexcg> I'm just wondering is there a way to determine the dependencies of a particular package? I just wanna make a minimal install of Slackware 13 (base system + X.org + some lightweight window manager like Fluxbox, and without gigabytes of libraries and programs that I'll never use).
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[05:58] <dchmelik> i think the Free Software port of Slackware has a dependency checker
[05:59] <dchmelik> otherwise just install Slackware 10 - 100 times and figure out what you use and not
[06:00] <alexcg> dchmelik, install Slackware 100 times? lol
[06:00] <dchmelik> also sometimes when you do not have something that is needed you will get an error that might help figure out what is needed
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[06:03] <alexcg> Okay, I think that the best solution is to try to remove the unnecessary packages from the full install of Slackware.
[06:04] <alexcg> By the way, dchmelik, what is the Free Software port of Slackware? Google doesn't help me.
[06:05] <dchmelik> Kongoni is the FS port
[06:05] <dchmelik> also, most of the package series are independent (besides a few important ones)... so if you do not want to install any of the package series for stuff like TeX you do not have to, for example
[06:05] <Nut-> I read somwhere, that Slackware also has such package manager, which knows the dependencies
[06:05] <goarilla> you read wrong
[06:05] <spook> not an official one
[06:05] <Nut-> Yes it's 3rd party
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[06:07] <Nut-> I think its name is slapt-get
[06:08] <dchmelik> alexcg: : Kongoni is the Free Software port
[06:08] <dchmelik> it is easiest to just install what you know you need and what you think you might need and do not install the rest
[06:09] <alexcg> Nut-: wikipedia says that slapt-get doesn't provide dependency resolution for packages included within the Slackware distribution.
[06:09] <Nut-> But how can the install CD find out what's needed, if you select groups
[06:09] <dchmelik> slapt-get is an obsolete updater, but I would suggest looking at Kongonit
[06:09] <dchmelik> Nut, it cannot
[06:09] <dchmelik> Kongoni*
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[06:10] <dchmelik> just read about what each package series is for and decide whether you need or think you might need it
[06:10] <Nut-> hmm, then sorry. I might read it wrong
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[06:10] <linXea> 'cause everything are in categories at install it's pretty straight forward what you might need and what you could remove. Spend some time on the install and google the stuff you don't understand. Basically, what you don't know about, you'll probably don't going to need.
[06:11] <dchmelik> that is not necessarily the case with things like gcc and libraries
[06:11] <dchmelik> at least not if you are thinking of downloading some software that has a ./configure script... which SlackBuilds may do
[06:12] <dchmelik> I have only ever been sure about removing a very few libraries
[06:13] <toytoy> guys, any of you tried dumping the contents of the slackware dvd to usb? I tried dd if=/path/to/dvd of=/dev/sdb1 where sdb1 is my pendrive. but when I boot it, it says there's no OS found. I didn't follow actually alienbob's coz I thought that would work coz it works in other linux distro.
[06:14] <linXea> toytoy, usb image need to be a .img file, not .iso
[06:14] <alexcg> Okay, thanks to everyone.
[06:15] <Delahunt> yeah read isolinux/README.TXT
[06:15] <Delahunt> er README_USB.TXT
[06:15] <Delahunt> it explainz
[06:15] <toytoy> linXea: How can I have the img? You mean the usbhd.img isn't it?
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[06:15] <toytoy> Delahunt: yeah, even here http://connie.slackware.com/~alien/tools/usbinstall/13.0/
[06:16] <Delahunt> i may be buying my buddy's Lenovo netbook
[06:16] <linXea> Delahunt, lenovo, made to last... great computers.
[06:16] <toytoy> because I thought dd'ing it would work automagically. I just wondering why it wasn't detected
[06:17] <linXea> toytoy, you have usb-boot activated in bios ?
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[06:20] <toytoy> linXea: yeah, i mean the pendrive was detected but it says no os detected.
[06:21] <toytoy> the contents of my pendrive is the same contents as dvd where I wonder why it wasn't detected, because pendrive has different approach than with dvd?
[06:22] <linXea> toytoy, 'cause my hardware don't allowed pendrive-boot I have no experience with it other than theoretical...
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[06:23] <metrofox> hi there
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[06:29] <sahk0> toytoy: the Slackware ISO is not hybrid, but if you update syslinux>=3.72 to some later version you can probably make it yourself
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[06:34] <toytoy> sahk0: I did it by just doing dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sdb1 where hda is my dvd drive with slack dvd installer and sdb1 where is my pendrive. I think that doesn't work? I'm currently following instead from slack http://connie.slackware.com/~alien/tools/usbinstall/13.0/
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[06:35] <sahk0> thats what im saying. for isos to be dd to usb sticks they need to be hybrid
[06:35] <sahk0> the .img's are another story
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[06:36] <sahk0> and im sure alienBOB says it better than i do
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[06:43] <toytoy> sahk0: when you say "isos to be dd to usb sticks they need to be hybrid" what does it mean?
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[06:44] <sahk0> in syslinux version 3.72 a new feature was introduced. if you upgrade syslinux to a version later than that you can dd any hybrid iso anywhere: http://syslinux.zytor.com/wiki/index.php/Doc/isolinux#HYBRID_CD-ROM.2FHARD_DISK_MODE
[06:45] <sahk0> you can do that even to an existing non hybrid iso afaik. the only time ive done it, it worked. not with a slackware iso though
[06:46] <toytoy> i see. let me try it. thanks for sharing this.
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[06:47] <sahk0> youre welcome
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[07:01] <alienBOB> toytoy: or read http://alien.slackbook.org/blog/installing-slackware-using-usb-thumb-drive/
[07:10] Action: Delahunt waves to alienbob
[07:11] <Delahunt> alienBOB, i'm surprised that pat doesn't keep USB images for all of Slackware on his website, since Slackware seems to be lighter and faster (probably more suitable for a netbook than any other distribution)
[07:15] <sahk0> any distribution running ratpoison is suitable for a netbook
[07:16] <sahk0> other than that you need a netbook specific interface
[07:19] <Delahunt> no, what i'm saying is that you can't just go grab a USB stick installer image for Slackware off of the website: you'd have to make your own
[07:20] <Delahunt> it's not outside my expertise but it is outside of the expertise of people who may want to use Slackware (instead of whatever bloated distribution they have now) on their netbook
[07:20] <Delahunt> not saying it's time to feed the n00bz or hold people's hand, just pointing out that many of the other distributions offer USB installers
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[07:20] <Delahunt> mandriva being one of them (i've personally installed it on netbooks before because it was the only distro i know that has a USB installer)
[07:21] <sahk0> well theres usbboot.img on the DVDs afaik
[07:21] <Delahunt> (emphasis on installer)
[07:21] <Delahunt> sahk0, that's only a boot image, it doesn't contain the packages
[07:21] <Delahunt> i'm saying a usb installer image that not only boots but has all the packages (think more like 4GB .img)
[07:22] <Delahunt> (granted if you leave /source out it can be as small as 2.5 GB iirc)
[07:22] <sahk0> bbl lunch time
[07:23] <Delahunt> sahk0 where are you located if you don't mind me asking
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[07:28] <dissociative> I disabled remote X11 in runlevel 4 and I need to get it back but I dont remember how
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[07:31] <dissociative> I think that I added the nolisten tcp option somewhere
[07:34] <Delahunt> dissociative, um in startx
[07:34] <Delahunt> /usr/bin/startx
[07:34] <Delahunt> defaultserverargs="-nolisten tcp"
[07:34] <Delahunt> that syntax above should work fine
[07:36] <Delahunt> at least that option is supposed to go there
[07:37] <dissociative> I found it
[07:37] <dissociative> I think
[07:38] <dissociative> in /etc/kde/kdm/kdmrc
[07:39] <Delahunt> why did you put it there?
[07:39] <dissociative> because runlevel 4 starts kdm
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[07:40] <dissociative> 57:ServerArgsLocal=-nolisten tcp
[07:40] <Delahunt> ServerCmd=/usr/bin/X -br -novtswitch -quiet
[07:41] <Delahunt> you could append to the end of that "-nolisten tcp"
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[07:45] <sahk0> Delahunt: hellas
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[07:46] <Delahunt> sahk0, ah you're Greek?
[07:46] <ComputerNewbie> i was reading the slackbook and man, slackware sounds like a pretty cool OS
[07:46] <ComputerNewbie> all these different commands
[07:46] <Delahunt> ComputerNewbie, thanks
[07:47] <sahk0> yes
[07:47] <Delahunt> sahk0, awesome!  i would LOVE to go to Greece, especially to hopefully meet Vangelis
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> i can see why someone would use slackware now
[07:48] <Delahunt> ComputerNewbie, new to Linux?
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> becuase initially i did init 4, and went into the GUI
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> yeah
[07:48] <sahk0> does he even live here?
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> and in the GUI, i was able to do everything i could do in windows
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> minus all the apps i have in windows...
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> so i was thinking.. "this is like windows, except the gui is shittier, and the mouse movement isnt as good as windows"
[07:48] <ComputerNewbie> "so why would anyone use this"
[07:49] <Pig_Pen> i seen that coming, i knew i smelled a troll
[07:49] <ComputerNewbie> but i guess you can do some cool stuff in the command :p
[07:49] <Delahunt> sahk0, i would think so, last i heard he teaches at a Greek Music University
[07:49] <Delahunt> although he probably also travels a lot
[07:49] <Delahunt> ComputerNewbie, using KDE?
[07:50] <dissociative> ComputerNewbie: It have to take a lot of time and effort to figure out that windows is like having half of an OS
[07:50] <dissociative> have/has
[07:50] <Delahunt> dissociative, what do you mean by that?
[07:50] <sahk0> he has written some amazing pieces of music. my sister used to be friends with his daughter.used to be penpal buddies
[07:50] <sahk0> but thats been a while ago
[07:50] <Delahunt> sahk0, wow
[07:51] <sahk0> i dont even remember much about it. wasnt a fan then tbh
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[07:54] <dissociative> Delahunt: to do almost something useful you have to install additional software everytime, and doing advanced stuff like NAT works like crap
[07:55] <dissociative> and others cons
[07:55] <Delahunt> dissociative, to do what?  let's take for example doing what rsync does.  would you have to install software for that?  (assuming just local copy of files, but not the entire thing)
[07:56] <Delahunt> (like to just copy over the differences)
[07:56] <dissociative> yes
[07:57] <dissociative> also port fowarding doesnt not work with ICS
[07:57] <Delahunt> actually there's xcopy, which has a lot of the abilities rsync does (minus the network ones, unless you are good enough to map a network drive to do xcopy over SMB)
[07:58] <Delahunt> port forwarding yes, but they did not (that i am aware of) envision a windows client OS (like windows xp home, vista home, 7 home, etc) that was able to function as a router.  for that you would probably need either additional software (like you said) or a server copy of windows
[07:59] <Delahunt> not being the devil's advocate (windows is the devil) but i think some of the "windows has no CLI" is based primarily on ignorance rather than fact
[07:59] <Delahunt> granted (like we both said) it wasn't meant for CLI (although it has more CLI tools than you may be aware of)
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[08:00] <ComputerNewbie> you are so politically correct :p
[08:00] <Delahunt> i used to schedule jobs on windows 2000 pro to automate file sharing and remote network backups on my LAN.  windows isn't necessarily crippled
[08:00] <Delahunt> but i still prefer even Ubuntu over Windows 8-)
[08:00] <ComputerNewbie> maybe the reason why windows CLI is not really used is because its not as good as linux's cli
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[08:02] <Delahunt> "is not really used" depends on the person
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[08:02] <Delahunt> even today i fired up cmd to troubleshoot a network issue
[08:03] <ComputerNewbie> you mean dos?
[08:04] <Delahunt> yes but the executable is "cmd"
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[08:04] <ComputerNewbie> what kind of command did you use
[08:04] <Delahunt> makes it faster on windows xp to just <win> r cmd <enter>
[08:04] <Delahunt> ipconfig
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[08:04] <ComputerNewbie> oh yeah
[08:04] <ComputerNewbie> ipconfig makes everything easier to access
[08:04] <ComputerNewbie> faster to access
[08:04] <ComputerNewbie> than having to look up that information the other wa
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[08:05] <Delahunt> i usually use xcopy as well due to options and speed when backing people's info up (unless i had to boot up slax to fix their issue, in which case i'm using rsync)
[08:05] <Delahunt> well windows vista and 7's network interface is a royal pain
[08:05] <Delahunt> i know enough to usually know what files are out of place (example: deleting viruses) and where viruses can hide
[08:06] <Delahunt> more often than not i'm helping people with windows (but always inserting a plug for "this is why you need to use Linux")
[08:06] <ComputerNewbie> are you a professional sys admin
[08:06] <Delahunt> people call me a computer genius and i just tell them i'm not a computer genius
[08:06] <Delahunt> no, i'm not pro, but honestly i ought to get paid by now
[08:06] <ComputerNewbie> you work for free?
[08:06] <Delahunt> that and knowing what belongs where in the registry and hunting down infections
[08:06] <ComputerNewbie> man thats a really indepth knowledge of windows
[08:07] <Delahunt> yes, i fix people's computers in the name of Jesus Christ
[08:07] <Delahunt> no, this is normal windows knowledge for anyone willing to learn
[08:07] <ComputerNewbie> well, everythings normal knowledge
[08:07] <ComputerNewbie> for anyone willing to learn
[08:07] <Delahunt> some dudes on #2cpu once wow'd me with how to run a cmd command to permanently remove windows messenger from windows (xp iirc)
[08:07] <dissociative> Delahunt: do you know how to setup ppp for a gsm modem?
[08:07] <Delahunt> but microsoft's documentation absolutely SUCKS
[08:07] <dissociative> gsm usb
[08:07] <Delahunt> dissociative, no, not on windows or linux, sorry, never messed with it
[08:08] <dissociative> I'm on it now
[08:08] <Delahunt> i think there was a document in the kernel Documentation directory for how to mess with it (wdc i think?)
[08:08] <Delahunt> i've been using computers since DOS 5 so really i'm no genius, i've just been a hobbyist for a long time
[08:08] <ComputerNewbie> thats a lot of hard work, time invested
[08:08] <ComputerNewbie> into learning about computers
[08:09] <dissociative> do you know how to program in assembler?
[08:09] <ComputerNewbie> assembler programming is really hard :p
[08:09] <Delahunt> i started to get into assembly with debug in DOS 6 but no not really
[08:09] <dissociative> I loved it
[08:09] <ComputerNewbie> i mean, with higher level languages
[08:10] <ComputerNewbie> why would anyone need assembler :p
[08:10] <Delahunt> a QBasic book i had included a few small assembly things that might be useful but QBasic on DOS 6 didn't have what QBasic+ had so no i never got into it
[08:10] <Delahunt> i do know that the computer doesn't like stack pointer and base pointer to be equal, causes a reboot
[08:10] <Delahunt> i would do that when i was a teenager, go to a computer store, fire up debug, mov sp,bp    mov bp,sp   etc and usually that caused it to suddenly reboot
[08:11] <ComputerNewbie> lol
[08:11] <Delahunt> i used debug to "hack" Civilization game saves to give me more gold
[08:11] <Delahunt> but that's about it
[08:11] <ComputerNewbie> whats debug>
[08:11] <ComputerNewbie> is that a program that u can use assembler
[08:11] <Delahunt> did a little bit of BATch file scripting, but not much because Windows/DOS didn't seem to have much in the way of shell stuff
[08:11] <Delahunt> debug is the assembler program on DOS 6
[08:11] <Delahunt> and if you have it in windows then you may be able to use stuff like that in Windows
[08:11] <ComputerNewbie> oh didnt know that :p
[08:11] <goarilla> it's a rudimentary debugger
[08:12] <ComputerNewbie> but the debugger is only for assembler code?
[08:12] <Delahunt> afaik
[08:12] <dissociative> real mode debug
[08:12] <dissociative> yes it is
[08:12] <goarilla> there is no other way in real mode :D
[08:12] <ComputerNewbie> so how would one go about hacking more gold in civ saved games :p
[08:12] <goarilla> nobody needs more than 640 kb :D
[08:12] <ComputerNewbie> do you run debug on the saved file
[08:13] <dissociative> brb
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[08:13] <Delahunt> you have to know the byte offset where the gold is stored
[08:13] <goarilla> i'm not sure but it's also a hex fewer
[08:13] <Delahunt> then you overwrite with how much gold you want
[08:13] <goarilla> viewer*
[08:13] <Delahunt> yeah i was using it as a hex viewer to do that
[08:13] <ComputerNewbie> oh ok
[08:13] <ComputerNewbie> with a hex viewer, can you reverse engineer code
[08:13] <Delahunt> have to be careful though, too much gold and you overwrite other necessary data
[08:14] <Delahunt> you can hack freeciv games to give yourself more gold too
[08:14] <ComputerNewbie> :p
[08:14] <ComputerNewbie> delahunt, did you learn slackware by reading slackbook
[08:14] <Delahunt> i got into that because Sim City had a program someone wrote (on bulletin board) to give yourself money
[08:14] <goarilla> reading
[08:14] <goarilla> writing ComputerNewbie
[08:14] <goarilla> :P
[08:14] <Delahunt> i learned slackware by diving in and fooling with it
[08:15] <Delahunt> i must've accidentally crashed my slackware like 5 times
[08:15] <ComputerNewbie> you wrote slackbook?
[08:15] <Delahunt> in a month
[08:15] <Delahunt> no i did not write slackbook
[08:15] <Delahunt> Alan Hicks did/does
[08:15] <goarilla> hehehehehe
[08:15] <Delahunt> i offered to help but he's too busy right now
[08:15] <alienBOB> Delahunt: Alan_Hicks updated the SlackBook, he did not write the original
[08:15] <Delahunt> my first linux was corel linux in 2000 but i gave up because it didn't like my gateway laptop
[08:16] <Delahunt> alienBOB, oh my badd
[08:16] <goarilla> you know what i like about linux
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[08:17] <goarilla> and slackware even when the system is foobarred it's still useful
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[08:17] <goarilla> my computer is BROKEN is a very grey area
[08:17] <goarilla> instead of black and white
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[08:18] <Delahunt> alienBOB, hey i asked your usb installer script to make a 2004MB image (probably a cut rate USB stick i'm using, but that's what cfdisk reports) but it made a 2048MB image.  i ran out of space (but i'm going "gangsta" with it and running fsck.ext2 because the script said 400-something MB were free on the ext2 so i figure just fix FS and press on)
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[08:18] <ComputerNewbie> well, i kind of want to learn slackware just so i can learn how to setup lamp systems because i figured it would help me with getting aj ob
[08:18] <ComputerNewbie> good to put on the resume..
[08:19] <Delahunt> alienBOB, ok it fixed, it seems good to go, but i figure i'd report it
[08:19] <ComputerNewbie> i can kind of see how convienent linux can be as a server OS
[08:19] <Delahunt> alienBOB, patrick wouldn't mind if i made the 512mb, 1gb, 2gb, and 4gb versions of at image file available on my web server would he?
[08:20] <Delahunt> (with of course the usual "this is not official, no warranties or guarantees, etc" warning
[08:20] <Delahunt> )
[08:20] <ComputerNewbie> because of all the CLI functionality, but as a workstation os, i think windows still has an edge :p
[08:20] <ComputerNewbie> at least for now imo :o
[08:21] <Delahunt> i'm sorry but windows is a pile of dog crap foisted on the masses, not due to being better, but due to being familiar and through evil business tactics
[08:21] <Delahunt> xp is the best they ever did but even Ubuntu is better imho
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[08:21] <alienBOB> Delahunt: nobody will bother you if you have these USB images available on a web server.
[08:21] <Delahunt> alienBOB, recommendations?  (i want to make sure i honor those whose work i am using)
[08:21] <alienBOB> ?
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[08:22] <Delahunt> it would be you and patrick and rworkman to mention, right?
[08:22] <Delahunt> i.e. "this is the work of these people..."
[08:22] <Delahunt> "using this script by this person...."
[08:22] <goarilla> what about the thousands of kernel developpers Delahunt
[08:22] <alienBOB> It will be your images, I have no recommendations other than that you mention the way / script to produce these images so other people can re-play
[08:22] <Delahunt> roger thanks
[08:22] <Delahunt> and thanks for your script, you made it very easy
[08:23] <alienBOB> But in general people will be wary about using bootable code (like a Slackware installer image) from random web sites.
[08:23] <goarilla> as they should
[08:23] <goarilla> i do thrust sourceforge.net tho
[08:24] <pim_> how long should tar be busy unpacking a 312kb file?
[08:24] <goarilla> a second
[08:24] <alienBOB> Depends on what is inside pim_
[08:24] <pim_> source code
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[08:24] <goarilla> unless it's a large archive and you only need the one file
[08:24] <alienBOB> IS it a tar or a tar.gz
[08:24] <torrmasta> Hot New Torrent site : http://Torrentpirates.org
[08:24] <goarilla> ban please
[08:25] ##slackware: mode change '+o alienBOB' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
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[08:25] <pim_> I did tar xzf virtualbox-kernenl-3.1.2.tar.xz
[08:25] <User____> happy new year to all slackers
[08:25] <pim_> it wouldn't though
[08:25] <alienBOB> Prick, he left
[08:25] <pim_> so I did tar xz only
[08:25] <init[1]> :D
[08:25] <pim_> but now it seems to have stalled
[08:25] <goarilla> newer versions of tar have the ability to find out if its bzipped or gzipped by itself
[08:26] <goarilla> try tar xvf
[08:26] <Delahunt> alienBOB, which irc client do you use?
[08:26] <goarilla> then you see progress
[08:26] <alienBOB> pim_: "xz -cd virtualbox-kernenl-3.1.2.tar.xz | tar -xvf -" is worth trying
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[08:26] ##slackware: mode change '-o alienBOB' by alienBOB!n=alien@about/slackware/alienBOB
[08:27] <goarilla> whatis xz any way
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[08:28] Nick change: urthwrm_ -> urthwrm
[08:29] <pim_> I don't know the tar xzf worked on a .tar.gz file but not on tar.xz
[08:29] <pim_> so I tried without f
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[08:29] <User____> i have an "off topyc" question. :) u, slackers, what mark u preffer: lenovo or acer as laptop
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[08:29] <Delahunt> User____, buy me one of each and i'll tell you in a month 8-)
[08:29] <goarilla> lenovo
[08:30] <User____> hardly lenovo?
[08:30] <Delahunt> i've installed mandriva on an acer aspire one, wasn't too bad
[08:30] <User____> but i readed somewhere they have some problem with the tuchpad
[08:30] <Delahunt> and i may be buying my buddy's lenovo
[08:30] <Delahunt> my buddy didn't say it had any problems with the touchpad...
[08:31] <User____> lenovo ideapad g550l and acer extensa 5235
[08:32] <Delahunt> go to pcmag and compare the two side by side or something
[08:32] <User____> well, i saw both models they are same
[08:32] <User____> but, well, u say lenovo, ok
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[08:33] <Delahunt> i say buy me one of each and i'll tell you in a month 8-)
[08:33] <Delahunt> customer reviews on various sites like pcmag and newegg are useful in terms of the rating they give but those can't tell the whole story
[08:33] <User____> is there a significant diference between "thinkpad" and "ideapad"
[08:34] <User____> both are cheep models with inter gma 4500 video
[08:34] <goarilla> yeah and lenovo only needs to make sure its thinkpad line is sturdy as per their deal with IBM
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[08:35] <pim_> when there is information about "putting the source somewhere" do I copy the actual source, evertyhing in the source directory or the entire directory with all the source files?
[08:35] <goarilla> i would buy a macbook if it had a trackpoint instead of a touchpad
[08:35] <Delahunt> ah i forgot that lenovo was an IBM thinkpad outsource
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[08:35] <Delahunt> i'd go lenovo but that's just me (i like the IBM line and my aunt works for IBM Tivoli)
[08:35] <goarilla> Tivoli the storage/backup stuff ?
[08:36] <User____> the only diff is the thinkpad model comes with 250 gb hdd, anth the ideapad comes with 300 gb hdd, same processors, same ram, same video i think
[08:36] <sahk0> goarilla: the town in italy
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[08:37] <goarilla> it's also a pretty nasty slope near my residence
[08:37] <goarilla> the 'tivoli'
[08:37] <sahk0> heh:)
[08:38] <Delahunt> i think tivoli is IBM's mega-corp commerce back-end
[08:38] <goarilla> idd
[08:38] <goarilla> but i'm sure if its IBM or HP
[08:38] <goarilla> not*
[08:38] <Delahunt> http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/tivoli/newto/
[08:38] <alisonken1home> ok
[08:39] <User____> so, if u are familiar with ibm, then what u preffer thinkpad or ideapad
[08:39] <Delahunt> only because my aunt works there
[08:39] <goarilla> it's IBM but HP does have cooperable stuff
[08:39] <goarilla> for it
[08:39] <sahk0> thinkpad t42
[08:39] <Delahunt> so far i haven't noticed any laptop from IBM that was garbage but now it belongs to Lenovo (i know) so ....
[08:39] <User____> wait i ll paste something in pastebin
[08:40] <sahk0> ascii porn?
[08:40] <User____> :)
[08:40] <User____> robo-porn
[08:40] <goarilla> Delahunt: IBM still has oversight over the Thinkpad Trademark iirc
[08:40] <Delahunt> yeah figures
[08:41] <pim_> I have logged in as root, I have done chmod -x to a script, and yet when I wish to execute it claims "acces denied"
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[08:41] <Delahunt> pim_, is it on a filesystem that is mounted noexec ?
[08:41] <pim_> Delahunt no it is not
[08:42] <pim_> unless that is the default slackware setting
[08:42] <Delahunt> i doubt it is
[08:42] <sahk0> pim_: chmod *+*x
[08:42] <pim_> sahk0 invalid mode
[08:42] <Delahunt> o.O
[08:43] <sahk0> chmod +x
[08:43] <sahk0> not -x
[08:43] <Delahunt> oh wow i didn't even notice that LOL
[08:44] <pim_> sahk0 thanks, but why doesn't chmod warn?
[08:44] <Delahunt> because you told it to remove execute permissions
[08:44] <Delahunt> - is for remove and + is for add
[08:44] <alisonken1home> that worked as expected - it removed (-x) execute permission
[08:44] <sahk0> warn about what? that you used the wrong but valid trigger?
[08:44] <sahk0> that would reqquire electrodes plugged to your brain
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[08:44] <sahk0> or some form of ai
[08:45] <sahk0> i guess it could tell you "file is already non executable"
[08:46] <pim_> sahk0 I didn't know -x was valid too
[08:46] <alisonken1home> pim_: man chmod
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[08:46] <sahk0> ah ok
[08:49] <sahk0> the slackbook explains these stuff btw
[08:49] <pim_> I was looking at the slackbuilds.org site
[08:50] <pim_> sahk0 Oh I just realized: you were talking about chmod?
[08:50] <sahk0> yeah
[08:51] <sahk0> bbiab
[08:51] <alisonken1home> pim_: based on your statement above about running chmod -x and wondering why the script didn't execute
[08:52] <User____> hey men, this the mashine i am looking for http://pastebin.com/d5a0bc798
[08:55] <ComputerNewbie> snoob, this is me... http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kxPG6y8Qctk/SuQEj8ns-LI/AAAAAAAAODQ/3knwJsy0PME/s400/Arnold+Schwarzenegger+Body+Building+Photos+(38).jpg
[08:55] <ComputerNewbie> oops
[08:55] <ComputerNewbie> wrong channel lol sorrhy
[08:55] <User____> is it appripriate for slackware 64 :)
[08:56] <Delahunt> User____, is the atom variant on it 64bit?  hold on let me check
[08:56] <Delahunt> oh dual core nevermind
[08:56] <Delahunt> yeah core 2 duo is 64bit afaik
[08:57] <Delahunt> oh krap wait
[08:57] <Delahunt> sorry, t4300 is p3-m but it says it's 64bit on wiki
[08:57] <Delahunt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Pentium_Dual-Core_microprocessors#.22Penryn-3M.22_.2845_nm.2C_standard_voltage.29
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[08:58] <Delahunt> # Based on the 64-bit Intel Core microarchitecture, using Penryn-3M core with 2MB of L2 cache disabled.
[08:58] <Delahunt> # All models support: MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology (EIST), Intel 64, XD bit (an NX bit implementation)
[08:58] <Delahunt> now i don't like how they say some of the L2 is disabled.  that might slow it down.  however, it's 64bit
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[09:00] <User____> well, but what u think about video, about mainboard and all as a mashine
[09:01] <Delahunt> it's intel video, it should work fine
[09:01] <Delahunt> don't expect omgfps
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[09:02] <User____> omgfps???
[09:02] <Delahunt> "omg frames per second"
[09:02] <Delahunt> it was a joke
[09:02] <Delahunt> my only concern is the wireless.  does it say what wireless chipset/card/manufacturer it is?
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[09:03] <Delahunt> it's probably Intel knowing IBM/Lenovo but still it's worth checking
[09:03] <Delahunt> usually intel wireless cards work great with Linux
[09:03] <Delahunt> there are some others i hear people complain about (like Broadcom)
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[09:03] <User____> i have not info about wireless, nor about hdd
[09:03] <Delahunt> the hard drive should be fine
[09:04] <Delahunt> as long as it's not something like HATA/OATA/DATA
[09:04] <User____> hdd is asigned 320, but i checked and it is 298,* gb
[09:04] <Delahunt> (hex ATA, octal ATA, decimal ATA, and yes that was a joke)
[09:04] <User____> :)
[09:05] <Delahunt> serial and parallel ATA will both be fine in Linux normally
[09:05] <User____> and u think that mashine is good for everything that i may do with linux at home, work and entertainment?
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[09:06] <Delahunt> check to see if someone's already put up a "how i did it" install page for slackware and that laptop
[09:06] <Delahunt> linuxonlaptops.net or something to that nature as well
[09:06] <User____> i checked but nothing founde
[09:07] Action: Delahunt shrugs
[09:07] <User____> well,
[09:07] <User____> ther eis a thinkpad, only 20 euro more expensive, with smaller hdd and cpu on 2.0ghz
[09:07] <User____> so i asked before is the thinkpad series better then ideapad
[09:08] <axyjo> hi all, I am able to boot into a text console, but as soon as I startx, I can't type nor can I move the cursor. I'm pretty sure that my xorg.conf is correct.
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[09:11] <User____> should 2 gb ram be quite enought for kde4?
[09:11] <gm152> Put these lines into the ServerFlags section of /etc/X11/xorg.conf:  Option "AutoAddDevices" "false" \ Option "AllowEmptyInput" "false"
[09:12] <gm152> The Option statements on separate lines of course.
[09:12] <axyjo> gm152: alright, thanks. I'll try that
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[09:13] <sahk0> axyjo: i suggest you read http://slackware.osuosl.org/slackware-13.0/CHANGES_AND_HINTS.TXT instead
[09:13] <sahk0> look for HAL
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[09:14] <sahk0> and the xorg stuff below that
[09:14] <axyjo> sahk0: it didn't work without an xorg.conf either, so I decided to make one using xorgconfig
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[09:15] <sahk0> did you do a full install enabling the hal daemon?
[09:15] <axyjo> sakh0: yeah
[09:18] <sahk0> i dont know then
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[09:20] <Pig_Pen> another method of building an xorg.conf is run X -configure and look at /root/xorg.conf.new (maybe copy to /etc/X11/xorg.conf after you edit to suit your purposes
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[09:34] <Delahunt> axyjo, did you try copying the visa one over to xorg.conf to see if that one worked?
[09:34] <axyjo> Delahunt: nope, just made a new one with xorgconfig. i'll try that too. you mean vesa, right?
[09:35] <Delahunt> yeah sorry
[09:35] <axyjo> Pig_Pen: I'll try that if the others don't work
[09:35] <axyjo> thanks
[09:35] <Delahunt> vesa, it's everywhere you want it to be 8-)
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[09:35] <axyjo> Delahunt: no worries, not trying to be a jerk, just didn't know if there was actually something called visa in slack
[09:35] <Delahunt> it's all good, my fault 8-)
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[09:46] <nrg>  Option          "ConnectedMonitor"   FOR  HDMI connections are DFP or HDMI?? at xorg.conf i use nvisia propertiary drivers
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[09:58] <sahilsk> hello there
[09:58] <sahilsk>  i need a help on slackware installation
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[09:59] <paul424> Hi what is the exe program ?
[10:00] <BP{k}> sahilsk: perhaps you would like to ask an actual question?
[10:00] <BP{k}> paul424: say what?
[10:01] <anavel> wiki should have a good answer
[10:01] <sahilsk> actually, i was in the partition manager ,(CFdisk), when i delete the partition and select its type, out of the various option i  didn
[10:01] <sahilsk> t find ext3 option
[10:01] <anavel> there is none.
[10:01] <sahilsk> and nor / , /home ,/boot
[10:02] <anavel> that, managed by /etc/fstab
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[10:02] <anavel> oh, you're installing slackware.
[10:02] <sahilsk> anavel: yes
[10:02] Action: anavel didn't read above.
[10:02] <alienBOB> sahilsk: there is a difference between partitioning (using cfdisk) and formatting
[10:02] <anavel> sorry.
[10:03] <BP{k}> sahilsk: cfdisk is a partition manager. not a format utility. You can roughly specify what *type* of file system it will be. But actual formatting is done later by the installer.
[10:03] <alienBOB> ext3 is a formatting option for mkfs
[10:03] <paul424> I see some exe command taking rexources in the top .
[10:03] <anavel> i think sahilsk is quite new with slackware.
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[10:03] <sahilsk> :D
[10:03] <sahilsk> yeah.
[10:03] <sahilsk> any guide that can help me?
[10:03] <BP{k}> paul424: imagine that, you use your computer and it's using resources?? wow.
[10:04] <anavel> sahilsk: iirc, you need to set partition first via cfdisk. That, before you type setup after booting slack cd/dvd.
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[10:04] <sahilsk> that[ what i was doing
[10:04] <BP{k}> sahilsk: http://slackbook.org/ and http://slackbasics.org also there are some install guides (albeit for older versions) on the net but the general principle pretty much goes.
[10:04] <Scuzz> sahilsk: after you get your partitions in order , durring the setup you can define your partitions and format them
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[10:04] <paul424>  BP{k} no , I said something completly diffrent !
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[10:05] <anavel> sahilsk: http://slackbasics.org/html/chap-install.html#chap-install-partitioning <-- read this.
[10:05] <User____> what is the better choise for that cpu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Pentium_Dual-Core_microprocessors#.22Penryn-3M.22_.2845_nm.2C_standard_voltage.29
[10:06] <User____> 32 or 64 bit slackware
[10:06] <Pig_Pen> cfdisk will do both, when you make a partition with cfdisk it also includes a filesystem of choice (with a Linux filesystem being the default)
[10:07] <sahilsk> Scuzz: when i was in the partition manager, i select the drive and delete it, when i press new, it give me option for primary/logical. I select ¨primary¨. But later on, when i enter the ¨type¨ of the drive, it doesn´t show me the ext3 and /usr ,/root, /boot ,partition type option.,instead it show me some 80 + never seen  option.
[10:07] <Scuzz> i use fdisk
[10:07] <anavel> you can define that after you created partitions.
[10:07] <anavel> which is on setup.
[10:08] <BP{k}> paul424: then try rephrasing your question so it makes a bit more sense.
[10:08] <anavel> sahilsk: like the guide says. create partition (not the filesystem and mount point) via cfdisk, then define those (filesystem (ext3) and mount point (/root) on setup.
[10:09] <paul424> What is the exe command ? is there any standar one in gnu linux   ?
[10:09] <alienBOB> Nope
[10:09] <thrice`> paul424, pastebin "ps aux"
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[10:09] <alienBOB> Rather, "ps auwwx | grep exe"
[10:09] <anavel> better "ps ax". That won't spill your usernames
[10:09] <anavel> -u
[10:09] <alienBOB> And "locate exe"
[10:10] <metrofox> well see ya
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[10:10] <sahilsk> what is the difference between primary and logical?
[10:11] <anavel> afaik, with primary you can only define up to 4 part. with logical, up to 127 iirc.
[10:11] <BP{k}> User____: seems those Penryns are 64bit capable processors, so depending on what you want to do, 64bit may be your best choice.
[10:11] <paul424> http://pastebin.com/d3990a0a5
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[10:11] <paul424> seems to be chrome engine or something./
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[10:11] <sahilsk> i thought ,primary deal with your , first HDD, and logical with another ,if any
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[10:12] <Scuzz> logical with reside on you primary
[10:13] <Scuzz> will*
[10:13] <sahilsk> so,i doesn´t matter which one is logical or primary. right?
[10:14] <sahilsk> *it
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[10:14] <alisonken1home> swap needs to be primary unless you're doing a swap file rather than a swap partition
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[10:15] <axyjo> i just got my mouse working in x (not really sure how), but my keyboard doesn't work. any tips?
[10:15] <sahilsk> oooh
[10:15] <john_dee> alisonken1home: why? i had it in extended partition?
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[10:15] <anavel> alisonken1home: hmmm... my swap is on logical
[10:16] <anavel> sda7
[10:16] <alisonken1home> john_dee: kind of like one less possible intermittent problem cropping up
[10:17] <anavel> axyjo: is it working on terminal/console ?
[10:17] <axyjo> anavel: yup, everything works fine on  the terminal
[10:17] <BP{k}> paul424: also reading proc(5) might help a bit (there are entries on /proc/self/ and /proc/[pid]/exe)
[10:17] <axyjo> it just goofs up when i execute startx
[10:18] <john_dee> well. you may be right. i remember having some strange behaviour in such setup before
[10:18] <axyjo> and since keyboard's not working, i can't kill x
[10:18] <sahilsk> anavel: so, using cfdisk, i just creat free space, and do not specify there File system type except for swap . ha??
[10:18] <Camarade_Tux> ctrl+alt+backspace?
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[10:18] <anavel> sahilsk: specify linux and linux swap there.
[10:19] <anavel> alisonken1home: what kind of intermittent problem ?
[10:19] <axyjo> Camarade_Tux: yeah, it doesn't respond to that.
[10:20] <Camarade_Tux> axyjo: tried the Magic SysRq? (also means: do you know about magic sysrq?)
[10:20] <User____> BP{k}: thanks
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[10:20] <axyjo> nope, no idea, Camarade_Tux
[10:20] <axyjo> i'll google it
[10:20] <sahilsk> anavel: since, cfdisk, doesn´t show me the ext3  partition, so which other should i use instead? llinux extended, extended, or what?
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[10:20] <alisonken1home> anavel: if I knew that, then I could help fix them
[10:21] <Camarade_Tux> axyjo: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_SysRq
[10:21] <anavel> sahilsk: you specify the filesystem and the mount point on slackware setup. That after you partitioning your hdd with cfdisk.
[10:21] <alisonken1home> I just know it's better to try and prevent possible issues beforehand
[10:21] <axyjo> Camarade_Tux: wow! that's cool! I didn't knwo you could emulate that keypress!
[10:21] <Camarade_Tux> tried alt+sysrq+r then release the keys and try ctrl+alt+F2, does it switch VT?
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[10:22] <axyjo> Camarade_Tux: I'll try that as soon as this boots up.
[10:23] <sahilsk> adn which kernal should i opt?
[10:23] <Camarade_Tux> axyjo: on slackware13? and messing with .fdi files?
[10:23] <anavel> sahilsk: huge-smp is usually good.
[10:24] <axyjo> yeah, i'm on slack13 and no I haven't touched the .fdi files for HAL yet. just the xorg.conf
[10:24] <anavel> btw, is there any good image viewer like gwenview that's gtk-based and doesn't need gnome ?
[10:24] <sahilsk> google picasa
[10:24] <Camarade_Tux> I use gpicview
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[10:24] <anavel> axyjo: are you just upgraded to slack 13 ?
[10:24] <sahilsk> but google picasa is damn good, image viewer
[10:24] <Camarade_Tux> *very* light (but otoh, I don't use gwenview, I don't know what it does exactly)
[10:25] <anavel> Camarade_Tux: just an image viewer. like acdsee.
[10:25] <Camarade_Tux> gpicview all the way (or qiv, it's gtk1)
[10:25] <sahilsk> picasa is great.  :(
[10:25] <axyjo> anavel: it's a clean install
[10:25] <anavel> gpicview reminds me of windows image viewer :S
[10:25] <Camarade_Tux> well, gpicview is like windows' image viewer
[10:25] <Camarade_Tux> anavel: :-)
[10:26] <anavel> lol
[10:26] <anavel> axyjo: try to disable hal on xorg.conf. I had similar problem with my mouse. works if i disable it
[10:26] <Camarade_Tux> it can open images and rotate them and... I think that's it :-)
[10:26] <axyjo> Camarade_Tux: that's cool! the sysrq thing works! at least I don't have to shut down the whole machine and reboot
[10:27] <anavel> axyjo: with  Option "AutoAddDevices" "off" and Option "AutoEnableDevices" "off" added on Section "ServerLayout".
[10:27] <axyjo> anavel: it's my keyboard that's not working. is it the same thing for that as well?
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[10:27] <anavel> axyjo: i dunno. try it.
[10:27] <anavel> :P
[10:27] <axyjo> anavel: sure :D
[10:27] <Camarade_Tux> axyjo: I've used it dozens of time when trying to get my mouse/keyboard properly set ;-)
[10:28] <sahilsk> where should i install LILLO , : root or mbr,; if i need to install window later on.
[10:28] <Camarade_Tux> argh
[10:28] <Camarade_Tux> you need to install windows first
[10:28] <hitest> yep
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[10:28] <sahilsk> naah, i won´ t install.
[10:28] <anavel> you can. After install linux, go to windows recovery console.
[10:28] <sahilsk> but just in case.
[10:29] <Camarade_Tux> well, you don't *need* but it's easier
[10:29] <sahilsk> so, i choose MBR??
[10:29] <axyjo> wait, if I disable hal, does that mean I can't hotplug devices anymore?
[10:29] <sahilsk> should i choose MBR right or root? :
[10:29] <thrice`> axyjo, if you completely shut hal down, yes.  if you just tell x.org not to use it? no, hal will still be running
[10:29] <anavel> axyjo: uhhh... what i mean is, do not make X depends on hal for detecting device. That's the option for.
[10:30] <axyjo> oh okay
[10:30] <axyjo> cool
[10:30] <axyjo> so as long as i don't do a /etc/rc.d/rc.hald stop, usb devices will still work?
[10:30] <thrice`> that's the theory :)
[10:30] <anavel> yeah.
[10:30] <axyjo> awesome
[10:30] <thrice`> actually, xfce and kde need hal running to operate properly
[10:30] <XGizzmo> sahilsk: You have to install it to the mbr if you wan't it to boot.
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[10:31] <anavel> i run both (xfce and kde). With X not using hal.
[10:31] <anavel> with that options
[10:31] <Camarade_Tux> (if you install windows later on, you'll have to install lilo again)
[10:32] <sahilsk> oki doki
[10:32] <axyjo> wow! those server flags helped a lot!
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[10:32] <anavel> axyjo: great.
[10:32] <thrice`> I think hal stuff just got yanked for x-server master last week
[10:32] <axyjo> thanks, Camarade_Tux thrice` anavel Delahunt sakh0 gm152
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[10:33] <hitest> the simplestthing would be to do what Camarade_Tux said. Install windows first leave space for Slackware. Install Slackware to free space, install lilo to MBR..
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[10:33] <anavel> i am guessing sahilsk already have windows installed.
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[10:35] <axyjo> one last thing. how do I start a window manager (dwm) without starting twm first, killing it, then starting dwm?
[10:35] <sahilsk> nope
[10:35] <sahilsk> its ubuntu studio :P
[10:35] <Camarade_Tux> when I have to put lilo back, I boot the slackware install with the usb installer (root=/dev/sda4) and just run lilo
[10:36] <adamk_> axyjo, Put dwm in your ~/.xinitrc file (or ~/.xsession file if you are using xdm to login).
[10:36] <axyjo> adamk_: thanks
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[10:40] <anavel> http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Lightweight_Applications#Image_Viewers <--- good list
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[10:42] <sahilsk> anavel: last question. what should be the FS type in CFDISK , for boot and root directory?
[10:42] <anavel> ext3 or reiserfs ?
[10:42] <anavel> i mixed those two on my 3 PCs.
[10:43] <sahilsk> ext3  is not in cfdisk
[10:43] Nick change: sirslack1r -> sirslacker
[10:43] <anavel> well, it's on slackware setup.
[10:43] <sahilsk> instead it had  : extended | linux extended .
[10:43] <spook> set them to type 83 linux
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[10:44] <spook> for swap its type 82 linux swap
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[10:44] <spook> all filesystems such as ext3 and reiserfs use type 83
[10:44] <sahilsk> great and what for boot
[10:44] <sahilsk> ?
[10:44] <spook> the same.
[10:45] <BP{k}> leather .. leather boots are the best.
[10:45] <sahilsk> but with boot flag on
[10:45] <sahilsk> right?
[10:45] <sahilsk> lol
[10:45] <spook> any particular reason you are using a seperate boot partition?
[10:45] <sahilsk> BP{k}:  yeah ,
[10:45] <sahilsk> i don know.
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[10:45] <spook> if you dont know, you probably shouldnt be doing it.
[10:45] <sahilsk> but this is what i used to do,  when i install ubuntu and other debian
[10:46] <spook> you dont need it.
[10:46] Action: anavel off taking a shower.
[10:46] <sahilsk> but it make the boot fast
[10:46] <thrice`> o'rly?
[10:46] <sahilsk> doesn¨t it?
[10:46] <spook> sahilsk: how do you think it does that?
[10:47] <thumbs> sahilsk: it doesn't.
[10:47] <pprkut> I would say quite the contrary. It makes it a bit slower
[10:47] <sahilsk> i am giving an extra space for bootstrap loader, so that
[10:47] <sahilsk> it can load i/o device fast and later kernal.
[10:47] <thumbs> sahilsk: that's bull crap
[10:48] <sahilsk> :D
[10:48] <spook> sahilsk: its your choice to do it, but i wouldn't recommend it.
[10:48] <sahilsk> even if i need to install window later on??
[10:48] <spook> windows?
[10:48] <sahilsk> yeah, later on
[10:48] <anavel> separating boot is quite good IMHO. mount it read-only so you won't accidentally deletes it :P
[10:49] <spook> doesn't make any difference.
[10:49] <thumbs> sahilsk: not related whatsoever.
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[10:49] <spook> anavel: uh, no.
[10:49] <thumbs> anavel: no.
[10:49] <anavel> just for fun, yeah ^_^
[10:49] <sahilsk> okk
[10:49] <spook> anavel: if you need to do that, then you're obviously a careless admin.
[10:49] <sahilsk> i like it
[10:49] <sahilsk> wait..
[10:49] <anavel> spook: enlighten me.
[10:49] <spook> sahilsk: its your choice to do it.
[10:49] <sahilsk> ^ _ ^
[10:50] Last message repeated 2 time(s).
[10:50] <sahilsk> this smiley is nice.
[10:50] <spook> anavel: if you need to protect your /boot from accidental deletion, something is quite wrong.
[10:50] <anavel> spook: what's the disadvantage of separating boot.
[10:50] <thumbs> sahilsk: you're odd.
[10:50] <sahilsk> :P
[10:50] <spook> anavel: read up.
[10:50] <vdv> if in /etc/passwd file there's an entry for some user and group number is specified here, then shouldn't this user also specified in /etc/group in corresponding group?
[10:50] <anavel> spook: beside that ?
[10:51] <sahilsk> thumbs:  it[ just the starting. I am about to install slackware. and when it complete, i´ll ask so many question that , you:l not find it odd any longer. :D
[10:51] <sahilsk> and that for sure
[10:52] <spook> sahilsk: read the slackbook?
[10:52] <thumbs> sahilsk: sane partitions are a good start.
[10:52] <sahilsk> definitely.
[10:52] <thumbs> sahilsk: next you'll use a separate /etc partition?
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[10:53] <usr13> vdv: It depends on how you set up the new user, (depends on what all the script did or didn't do at that time).
[10:53] <spook> vdv: i have this sneaking feeling you are mistaken about how groups and users work, but i'm not sure exactly what you are asking.
[10:53] <sahilsk> spook: i will not made a separate 200mb partion for /boot.
[10:53] <spook> sahilsk: why are you telling me?
[10:54] <sahilsk> so that you can say, ¨ok¨. fine or similar thing to me
[10:54] <hitest> sahilsk: I have a swap, /, and seperate /home partition
[10:54] <sahilsk> hitest: thanks. you know what i inteneded to ask.:D
[10:54] <thumbs> sahilsk: for production servers, sometimes a separate /tmp is recommended.
[10:55] <thumbs> sahilsk: for a desktop, it's overkill.
[10:55] <sahilsk> thumbs: which desktop environment should i choose?
[10:55] <hitest> having a seperate /home partition is nice as it makes upgrades down the road easier
[10:55] <thumbs> sahilsk: the one you want.
[10:55] <sahilsk> it doesn´t have enlightenment
[10:55] <sahilsk> :(
[10:55] <thumbs> sahilsk: congratulations
[10:55] <thumbs> sahilsk: install it!
[10:56] <init[1]> sahilsk: xfce would be a good start.
[10:56] <sahilsk> very funny...
[10:56] <sahilsk> thanks.
[10:56] <init[1]> sahilsk: thumbs isn't joking.
[10:56] <thumbs> sahilsk: there's a slackbuild for it on sbo.
[10:56] <hitest> xfce is quite light and fast
[10:57] <sahilsk> thumbs:  yeah, i can install, it later on. no doubt about it.
[10:57] <thumbs> sahilsk: then what's the problem?
[10:57] <goarilla> he doesn't like manual labour ?
[10:57] <init[1]> sahilsk: if you are just starting of with slackware , imo just get the feel of it on VM.
[10:58] <sahilsk> what[ the numeric code for the /home or /src?
[10:58] <mancha> 42
[10:58] <thumbs> sahilsk: the what?
[10:58] <spook> sahilsk: again, type 83, linux
[10:58] <usr13> vdv: When you add a new user, you'll need to edit the /etc/group file in order to give what ever privileges to the new user as you see fit.  You are the sysadmin of your system, (that is, if it IS your system).
[10:58] <sahilsk> thanks ,mancha.. that was fast.
[10:58] <mancha> fast and also a joke :)
[10:59] <sahk0> sahilsk: read the content of the links in the channel topic
[10:59] <usr13> mancha: What, xfce?
[10:59] <spook> mancha: 42 is SFS, whatever that means
[10:59] <mancha> 42 is also the meaning of lie
[10:59] <mancha> life
[10:59] <sahilsk> spook:  83 is for root , but what if i need to make a /home ? slackware setup doesnt show any such option later on ?
[10:59] <sahk0> sahilsk: http://slackbook.org
[10:59] <hitest> sahilsk: setup will guide you through partitioning your HD, formatting it and choosing the FS
[11:00] <thumbs> sahilsk: you're not asking very intelligent questions.
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[11:00] <mancha> spook, for further info on this, type vim and then :help 42
[11:00] <spook> sahilsk: go read slackbook, i have this feeling you would benefit from reading it again
[11:00] <spook> mancha: yes, i got the reference when you made it. i was talking partition types
[11:02] <mancha> i don't think many people know about vim's secret/fun codes, so i am sharing  :help 42    :)
[11:02] <sahilsk> i am reading that book. Sire :(
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[11:02] <hitest> sahilsk: if you want a seperate /home partition leave space for it during partitioning, make the partition type 83 then mount later during setup as /home. don't forget to make your root partion bootable.
[11:02] <hitest> partition
[11:02] <thumbs> hitest: the latter is not required, technically.
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[11:03] <hitest> which
[11:03] <thumbs> hitest: making the partition bootable.
[11:04] <usr13> sahilsk: If you create more than one type 83 partition, the installer will ask what to do with the second one (or other ones), at which time, you can specify /home
[11:04] <hitest> yep
[11:04] <sahilsk> ooh, that[ nice.
[11:04] <usr13> sahilsk: It first asks for one for  /    and then will ask what to do with any others it sees.
[11:05] <sahilsk> okkk
[11:05] <spook> thumbs: its only needed if you install the bootloader to the superblock, right?
[11:05] <sahilsk> i am going for it.
[11:05] <thumbs> spook: yes.
[11:05] <anavel> http://blog.flameeyes.eu/2007/11/02/why-people-insist-on-using-boot
[11:06] <init[1]> sahilsk: on real hw ?
[11:06] <hitest> thumbs: interesting. thanks:)
[11:06] <sahilsk> thanks guys, thumbs spook usr13 init[1] anavel ,hitest and all. gotta go. neet to reboot my comp. :D
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[11:06] <init[1]> sahilsk: better play on VM
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[11:06] <init[1]> crap :-/
[11:07] <sahk0> better rtf documentation
[11:07] <hitest> yeah....he'll be back methinks
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[11:08] <spook> anavel: hey look, last line in that post is the first thing i said.
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[11:15] <hitest> thumbs: I typically need to make my root partition as bootable as I usually dual boot Slackware 13 with Slackware-current on my main box (two root partitions)
[11:17] <pprkut> I needed to define a bootable partition on my notebook, otherwsie lilo wouldn't load. even from mbr
[11:18] <goarilla> weird
[11:18] <sahk0> i think the installer marks the partition as bootable on its own
[11:18] <thumbs> hitest: a boot loader on the mbr is fine. You don't need to flag it as bootable.
[11:19] <thumbs> hitest: it's handy for legacy bioses.
[11:19] <hitest> thumbs: thanks. good to know:)
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[11:19] <dagnachew> hello everyone
[11:19] <dagnachew> happy new year
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[11:20] <goarilla> thumbs: i don't understand why it would be handy for even legacy bioses
[11:20] <dagnachew> please help
[11:20] <dagnachew> lvm lvresize /dev/VolGroup00/lvolswap -L +10G
[11:20] <dagnachew>   Extending logical volume lvolswap to 14.00 GB
[11:20] Channel flood from dagnachew -- kicking
[11:20] <dagnachew>   Insufficient suitable contiguous allocatable extents for logical volume lvolswap: 2560 more required
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[11:20] <pprkut> sahk0: at least not the installer for 12.2
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[11:20] <goarilla> not even 12.0
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[11:21] <pprkut> thumbs: well, as said, I had to. Lilo refused to load. Once /boot was bootable it worked.
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[11:21] <sahk0> pprkut: maybe.i never mark the partitions as bootable but as ive seen cfdisk shows em as such
[11:21] <sahk0> at least with 13.0 dont remember before
[11:22] <hitest> I've had an install not boot when / partition not marked as bootable, hence my caution. but, I'll try this in the future
[11:22] <goarilla> which stupid bios looks for a partition marked is bootable in the mbr ?
[11:22] <goarilla> as*
[11:22] <sahk0> maybe cause i choose the expert lilo configuration method?
[11:22] Action: pprkut has no bios. has efi
[11:22] <sahk0> and manually add a linux partition
[11:24] <goarilla> i would find it stupid if a bios would look for a bootable primary partition before executing the 446 bytes of code in the mbr
[11:24] <goarilla> and decided it wouldn't if there weren't any
[11:24] <usr13> goarilla: I dont think cmos looks for partitions at all, just drives.
[11:25] <usr13> goarilla: That is why you have to have some sort of bootloader in MBR
[11:26] <goarilla> yes those are the 446 bytes
[11:31] <toytoy> alienBOB: I have a question if I did use the usbimg2disk.sh where the usbboot.img is extracted to my pen drive. Now, since I wanted to bring the whole slackware to my pendrive, should I only copy-paste the /extra, /kernels, and /slackware64 directories to my pen drive?
[11:34] <usr13> toytoy: I just use the CD to boot and tell the installer to install packages from my pen drive (where I've copied them from DVD there).
[11:35] <toytoy> usr13: I have no cd/dvd drive for my net book.
[11:35] <usr13> toytoy: ahhh ok.
[11:36] <usr13> well if the pen drive is big enough just put the whole DVD on it, (after you've made it bootable).
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[11:37] <toytoy> usr13: yeah but how? you mean copy-paste? or dd? i tried dd earlier and it fails. So I use this http://slackware.osuosl.org/slackware-13.0/usb-and-pxe-installers/usbimg2disk.sh
[11:37] <MarderIII> toytoy: use program unetbootin
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[11:37] <toytoy> unetbootin: seems no slackware 13.0 there.
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[11:38] <MarderIII> toytoy: correct, but can "burn" downloaded isos
[11:39] <usr13>  cp -a /mnt/cdrom/ /media/usb/  or cp -a /media/slackware-whateve-it-is /media/disk/  or something like that.
[11:39] <toytoy> MarderIII: I see, but I want to follow alienBOB's coz it's understandable how everything goes
[11:40] <usr13> toytoy: mount the DVD and then do ^^^
[11:40] <MarderIII> Ok. Success :-)
[11:40] <usr13> toytoy: but you can use the file manager as well, that's ok  And all you really need is slackware/
[11:41] <usr13> cp -a /media/slackware-whateve-it-is/slackware /media/disk/
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[11:41] <toytoy> usr13: I see and also kernel directory?
[11:42] <usr13> toytoy: You don't want to use dd because dd will create an image, you want to copy files.
[11:42] <usr13> toytoy: Like I said, just take it all if the thumb drive is big enough.
[11:43] <toytoy> yeah, 8GB of space
[11:43] <usr13> toytoy: ok, but like I said, all you need is slackware/
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[11:44] <usr13> because you already have a kernel to boot from.  Other kernels are installed as packages.
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[11:54] <SpacePlod>   /win 1
[11:54] <SpacePlod> ugh.
[11:54] <MarderIII> wrong window?
[11:55] <MarderIII> :-)
[11:55] <mancha>  /lose 1
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[12:38] <deximat> Can someone help me with question Linux(Slackware) or Unix(OpenSolaris)?
[12:40] <usr13> deximat: Sure, ask... give us a shot.
[12:40] <deximat> usr13 can you give me some basic poins why unix why linux, why not? In general
[12:41] <hitest> deximat,: why use Unix or Linux?
[12:41] <usr13> deximat: Depends on what you want to do with the machine.
[12:42] <usr13> some things may be better done on Unix but for most part better to go with Linux.
[12:43] <usr13> deximat: Depends on your needs.  (That is a pretty open / wide range question - sort of un-answerable).
[12:43] <hitest> deximat: we are biased in favour of Linux here:)
[12:43] <usr13> hitest: As well we should be.
[12:43] <hitest> yes
[12:43] <deximat> :(
[12:44] <deximat> so hard to take a dessision
[12:44] <usr13> deximat: OSS is the way to go  for a lot of reasons and for most purposes.
[12:44] <hitest> deximat: do you have Linux experience?
[12:44] <deximat> yes
[12:44] <hitest> in?
[12:44] <sahk0> i found opensolaris really nice. but its packaging in general is just horrible.
[12:45] <sahk0> are you thinking to use it on a desktop or a server?
[12:45] <deximat> debian, slackware
[12:45] <mac-> anyone have experience with SpeedStep technology ?
[12:45] <deximat> I need stability to keep my data safe
[12:45] <mac-> how to enable with automatic scaling ?
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[12:45] <deximat> I need some basic thing I used to use my computer for
[12:46] <hitest> such as?
[12:47] <deximat> music, movies,...
[12:47] <nachox> deximat, there is no definite answer to your question, you'd need to test both and decide for yourself
[12:47] <deximat> And a main thing is to have control
[12:47] <deximat> thats why I love slackware
[12:48] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: what's the problem? your cpu is always at full speed?
[12:48] <mancha> a second ago you wanted to know why linux and now you're a slackware fan? huh?
[12:48] <sahk0> a desktop then. opensolaris is not a good desktop os yet imo
[12:48] <mancha> doesn't compute, will robinson
[12:48] <nachox> it's not
[12:48] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: hello again :)
[12:48] <sahk0> maybe freebsd might be better and somewhere in between
[12:48] <sahk0> with zfs
[12:48] <hitest> I'm a Unix user, specifically FreeBSD, but, I now exclusively use Slackware.
[12:48] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: I wish to make it enable on my ThinkPad to scale automatically
[12:49] <Camarade_Tux> cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
[12:49] <Camarade_Tux> and are you using kde or xfce?
[12:49] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: now I have different cpu frequencies for random reboots, sometime it is 792MHz, sometimes 410MHz etc
[12:50] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: how do you see the cpu speed?
[12:50] <deximat> :( I think I will be back to linux :)
[12:50] <mancha> is the lower HZ on sundays? it might be resting
[12:50] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: cat /proc/cpuinfo
[12:50] <hitest> deximat: if you love Slackware stick it; it meets your stability requirements
[12:51] <deximat> I had an issue on opensolaris that crushed a whole system
[12:51] <deximat> i just run cheese
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[12:51] <Pig_Pen> lulz! stick slackware where? hitest
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[12:51] <hitest> LMAO
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[12:52] <hitest> should have said stick with it
[12:52] <Pig_Pen> more better :)
[12:52] <deximat> Why slackware doesnt support gnome? KDE 4 is very heavy
[12:52] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: have a look at the files in /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq , cat them and check how they look
[12:52] <Pig_Pen> xfce or fluxbox
[12:52] <hitest> deximat: go with xfce then
[12:52] <Camarade_Tux> also, which processor? and how fast should it be?
[12:52] <Pig_Pen> just install kde for the apps, (not the desktop)
[12:53] <hitest> agreed
[12:53] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: have only /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/ with cpuidle and crash_notes
[12:53] <hitest> XFce 4.6.1 is speedy enough
[12:53] <deximat> yes, but gnome has some good software too
[12:54] <mac-> now compiling kernel modules for speedstep, but even without that it seems that BIOS changes for some reason CPU Freq without OS at prsent
[12:54] <Pig_Pen> windowmaker is cool if you like nostalga
[12:54] <sahk0> mozilla products are not a gnome applications :p
[12:54] <sahk0> s/a/
[12:54] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: please give me a while to modprobe them after complete compilation
[12:54] <deximat> sahk0 thank you!
[12:54] <sahk0> anytime:)
[12:54] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: actually, if the computer is APM and not ACPI, I *think* it may be up to the BIOS to do that
[12:55] Action: Camarade_Tux not sure at all
[12:55] <Camarade_Tux> also, which CPU is it? P3-M?
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[12:55] <Pig_Pen> that goodness for that, i am glad not all the GTK based apps jumped on the gnome bandwagon, it would ruin gimp, mozilla, openoffice and many other apps
[12:55] <ccfreak2k> Would my pub/priv keys be stored in ~/.ssh?
[12:55] <Camarade_Tux> Pig_Pen: they run on windows
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[12:55] <Camarade_Tux> and for *that* we can be really thankful to windows!
[12:55] <deximat> you like kde more?
[12:56] <hitest> deximat: I primarily use XFce and Fluxbox
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[12:58] <Pig_Pen> thank goodness for windows badness
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[13:02] <Pig_Pen> http://www.sampsonuk.net/B3TA/TrojanHorse.jpg  (here is an example of windows badness)
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[13:03] <Camarade_Tux> Pig_Pen: although, here, s/window/mac os x/ works too
[13:04] <Pig_Pen> yup, just because Apple's products are pretty does not mean they dont suck
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[13:06] <Camarade_Tux> I *hate* apple ;-)
[13:06] <agentc0re> my new excuse to read and share information  http://urlg.in/1gd
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[13:06] <spook> Pig_Pen: its the reason they suck
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[13:09] <fwc> i think i need more kingston 40gb SSDs.. getting 390mb/s with dmraid, be nice to get around 1000 with a real raid card
[13:09] <fwc> anyone wanna donate?
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[13:10] <seanj> Hi, everytime I run patch it says "only garbage was found in the patch input"
[13:10] <spook> how many have you got now?
[13:11] <fwc> seanj, how are you running patch? and are you sure the patch is good? :P
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[13:12] <seanj> fwc: I don't know much about patches, but I've tried 3 different ones from 3 different people, trying to patch Wine... I'm certain I got at least one of them to work in the past. On Slackware 13.
[13:12] <fwc> spook, just a pair in this computer, thinking i might do a 3rd this week.. not sure ill get much better than 390mb/s through the AMD SB though
[13:12] <seanj> fwc: and I don't see anyone else who used the patches having problems. ...
[13:12] <fwc> seanj, can you show me exactly what youre typing to attempt the patch?
[13:13] <seanj> sure fwc
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[13:13] <seanj> seanj@blacky:~/Downloads/wine-1.1.35$ patch -p0 ~/Documents/mousepatch.diff dlls/dinput/mouse.c
[13:14] <Camarade_Tux> nope
[13:14] <Camarade_Tux> -i path/to/your/patch
[13:14] <spook> fwc: with 4 1tb disks in mdadm raid 10 --layout f2 i get about the same speed :)
[13:14] <Camarade_Tux> or patch -p0 < path/to/your/patch
[13:14] <seanj> Great! That worked. Thanks fwc and Camarade_Tux.
[13:15] <fwc> woa i go afk for a sec and ya get it all fixed :)
[13:15] <fwc> good game haha
[13:15] <seanj> haha fwc yep... I should have read the man/info better...
[13:15] <fwc> spook, but whats your random 4kb block readrate? :P
[13:16] <spook> fwc: i never go around to doing random read/write testing
[13:16] <spook> fwc: http://spooksoftware.com/blockspeed/
[13:16] <fwc> seanj, haha *shrug* im sure worse questions have been asked :p
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[13:17] <fwc> ahh the WD10EADS, i have a couple of those
[13:17] <fwc> they WERE WD10EACS, but.. apparently the EACS didn't want to live in my computer :P
[13:17] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: APM turned off in kernel - ACPI-only enabled
[13:17] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: it is Pentium III 800MHz
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[13:18] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: in IBM ThinkPad T21
[13:18] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: I think APM can change your CPU speed without any support from the kernel, but I'm not sure
[13:18] <Camarade_Tux> mac-: pastebin your dmesg
[13:19] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: you mean APM == BIOS ?
[13:19] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: ok I will pastebin dmesg, give me a while
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[13:22] <spook> fwc: http://spooksoftware.com/blockspeed/raid10-far2-read.png  thats what i'm talking 'bout.  units in megabyte/s
[13:22] <agentc0re> antiwire: oh cool.  i'll have to check it out.  need to try A/V w/pidgin again sometime too and see if they fixed some of that stuff yet.
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[13:22] <Camarade_Tux> from wikipedia: The CPU core is always controlled through the APM BIOS (there is no option to control it through a driver). Drivers can use APM function calls to notify the BIOS about CPU usage, but it is up to the BIOS to act on this information; a driver cannot directly tell the CPU to go into a power saving state.
[13:22] <Camarade_Tux> have you checked your BIOS to see if you can enable/disable APM and disable/enable ACPI?
[13:24] <fwc> spook, thats pretty good.. ever tried SSDs in a raid though? pretty noticeable when you start up X
[13:25] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: I will, now wish wait till kernel modules compilation finishes
[13:25] <spook> fwc: havent, no.
[13:25] <fwc> although i do envy having that much storage space haha
[13:25] <spook> i'm already plotting to build a bigger one
[13:25] <fwc> having 80gb on the one computer is tight, feels like im in the dark ages of computing
[13:26] <fwc> since everything is massive now
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[13:26] <spook> about 8 x 2tb disks
[13:26] <fwc> haha nice
[13:26] <spook> same raid config i'm thinking.
[13:26] <XGizzmo> I wish I had the money to run a SSD Raid array.
[13:27] <fwc> kingston drives are only $130 a pop, not cheap for the capacity, but not terrible
[13:27] <fwc> and theyre intel G2 controllers with 34nm flash
[13:27] <nachox> xgizzmo, sell the house and the gf
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[13:27] <fwc> ^ that.
[13:27] <fwc> :p
[13:27] <spook> even better, turn the house into a bordello and pimp out the gf.
[13:28] <fwc> then youre makin money.
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[13:29] <XGizzmo> yeah but i would have to clear it with the wife first. dont see that happening.
[13:29] <sahk0> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DI3Znt029jQ
[13:30] <spook> XGizzmo: pimp out the wife too
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[13:31] <jeev> XGizzmo, tell her you'll give her a night with me.. if she's hot
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[13:32] <lowkyalur> happy new year. how would i extend bash autocompletion to eg also complete man help topics and certain cli arguments?
[13:32] <Camarade_Tux> jeev: will you take me for a night with you :-)
[13:33] <Camarade_Tux> lowkyalur: hmmm, anything against zsh?
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[13:33] <lowkyalur> Camarade_Tux: what's the difference?
[13:33] <jeev> Camarade_Tux, unless if you're beyonce with thinner legs then no
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[13:34] <sahk0> lowkyalur: bash completion is maintained by debian now is alioth. you might wanna check that. slackware's in extra is very outdated
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[13:34] <sahk0> s/is/in
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[13:34] <Camarade_Tux> jeev: crap =/
[13:35] <Camarade_Tux> lowkyalur: zsh is know for its completion, might be worth a look
[13:35] <Camarade_Tux> (I can tab-complete almost anything)
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[13:36] <antiwire> The prices for some of the crappy laptops posted on CL are utterly amazing.
[13:36] <sahk0> zsh has all completions built in and maintained upstream
[13:36] <sahk0> unlike all other shells
[13:37] <lowkyalur> Camarade_Tux: oki. i fear a new shell so i first check the debian package.
[13:37] <sahk0> lowkyalur: do you have bash-completion installed from extra/ ?
[13:37] <lowkyalur> sahk0: nope
[13:37] <sahk0> afaik that completes man pages
[13:37] <sahk0> well, start with that
[13:38] <lowkyalur> fine. new plan: first check the slack package
[13:38] <sahk0> it might suit your needs
[13:38] <sahk0> see http://embraceubuntu.com/2006/01/28/turn-on-bash-smart-completion/ how to enable it
[13:39] <sahk0> fuck ubuntu specific link. ignore
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[13:39] <lowkyalur> lol
[13:39] <sahk0> slackware doesnt have /etc/bash.bashrc
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[13:42] <sahk0> anyway do what the article says in ~/.bashrc
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[13:47] <lowkyalur> super  works like a charm. thank you!
[13:48] <Azeotrope> Do you have any advices on restring a user? So far I put bin/false.
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[13:49] Nick change: fwc -> FrankD
[13:52] <sahk0> userdel. whats the point of having a user if login isnt an option?
[13:53] <sahk0> s/of/in
[13:53] <sahk0> damn ive been writing like that all day
[13:53] <FrankD> sahk: email? :D
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[13:57] <goarilla> sahk0: a lot of stuff runs like users without logins
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[13:58] <goarilla> hald, messagebus, ftp clients, smb users, ...
[13:58] <goarilla> mysql, apache, ...
[13:59] <sahk0> that doesnt sound like thats case
[14:00] <sahk0> the
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[14:01] <Camarade_Tux> if you're root, you can use without password afaik
[14:02] <jonsmith1982> when shell is set to /bin/false? can't run any commands. afaik
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[14:09] <spook> you can su to that user, but you cant login as them
[14:09] Nick change: derfz -> dErFz
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[14:13] <nachox> you can su to that user IF you use -c something
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[14:20] <InspectorCluseau> the pop up calendar here on 13 is messed up - no January 2010. Dec 2010 pops up. Anyone else?
[14:21] <FrankD> hahaweird o.O
[14:21] <FrankD> dec 24th 2010 my ass
[14:22] <sahk0> there was a thread at LQ. its a kde 4.2.4 problem
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[14:24] <FrankD> oh sweet, i was just kicking the date back trying to get to jan
[14:25] <FrankD> and it crapped out on me,byebye WM o.O
[14:26] <FrankD> kde 3.5 is showing the correct date, but week 53 of 2010 o.O
[14:27] <InspectorCluseau> it's always the simple apps that get screwed up
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[14:31] <goarilla> spook
[14:31] <goarilla> if you su to those users
[14:31] <goarilla> your UID does not change
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[14:37] <fredoslack> Hello
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[15:00] <jescis> what would be the outcome when I use a swap partition that's 3 or 4 time the amount of RAM?
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[15:01] <fwc> jescis: youd have a swap partition 3-4 times your amount of RAM.
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[15:03] <jescis> fwc, but would it help or not?
[15:03] <thrice`> help what?
[15:03] <fwc> jescis: help what? :P
[15:03] <fwc> jescis: are you running out of ram?
[15:03] <thrice`> if you expect an answer, you need to ask a question
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[15:04] <jescis> my computer seems to freeze when I'm watching an avi video file :-\
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[15:04] <fwc> jescis.. does it freeze, or does it not freeze?
[15:05] <fwc> you need to describe what your problem is and howd youd like it to be a little better if you want help
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[15:05] <nenad> hi, I have an issue with skype, I installed it from slackbuilds, and it went ok, but when I try to run it it says there is no file named skype in.. and when I go to /usr/bin directry with ls command binary is there... I dont understand
[15:05] <nenad> Please help, thanks
[15:06] <thrice`> nenad, first, run this: "
[15:06] <thrice`> uname -m
[15:06] <beatzz> so to host a dhcpd server, i need to edit my routing table, and edit /etc/dhcpd.conf and edit iptables ?
[15:06] <jescis> fwc, I just had to reset/reboot because all I could do was move the mouse pointer, and when I go full screen it's even worse
[15:06] <beatzz> why is there not a rc.dhcpd
[15:06] <beatzz> ?
[15:07] <fwc> jescis.. how can it be worse than that?
[15:07] <sahk0> theres rc.inet1
[15:08] <fwc> what kind of computer do you have? do you have any other problems with it?
[15:08] <fwc> how much ram do you have?
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[15:08] <fwc> what kind of cpu? what are you using to play the video?
[15:08] <fwc> what video driver are you using?
[15:08] <fwc> what video card isit?
[15:09] <fwc> ^ all good information
[15:09] <nenad> fwc, can you help me?
[15:09] <fwc> you cant expect people to endlessly fish :P
[15:09] <sahk0> a/s/l ?
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[15:09] <thrice`> nenad, I already told you, what does "uname -m" say ?
[15:10] <nenad> x86_64
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[15:10] <thrice`> great, now "file /usr/bin/skype"
[15:10] <jescis> fwc, Well I thought what I gave was enough at the time... I didn't think of what to say at first. :-\
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[15:11] <fwc> jescis, well nobody here is a mind reader :p you want help diagnosing a problem, you have to give something
[15:12] <nenad> hey
[15:12] <jescis> fwc, I know, I just have that sort of issue in my self :p
[15:12] <thrice`> nenad, seriously, can you try to pay attention?  "file /usr/bin/skype"
[15:13] <nenad> no, I cant paste it
[15:13] <nenad> it doesnt send you
[15:13] <nenad> here is link
[15:14] <nenad> http://notepub.com/?note=15829
[15:14] <fwc> hah before you run the slackbuild script do "export ARCH=x86_64"
[15:14] <thrice`> nenad, ok, you're on 64-bit, but skype is 32-bit.  slackware64, by default, will not support 32-bit binaries.
[15:14] <thrice`> I don't think skype offers a 64-bit binary
[15:15] <nenad> can I force it to run 32bit
[15:15] <fwc> oh right, proprietary funness
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[15:15] <thrice`> nenad, nope
[15:16] <nenad> :(
[15:16] <fwc> nenad: you can install a set of 32 bit libs.. but really it says not found? not incompatible binary format or something?
[15:16] <nenad> i will paste
[15:16] <hiptobecubic> nenad, no. you can either install multi-lib slack, which may or may not go well for you based on these questions, or you can avoid skype. or you can run it in a VM like qemu on a 32bit os
[15:16] <nenad> bash: /usr/bin/skype: No such file or directory
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[15:18] <thrice`> nenad, yes, that's because you are on 64-bit, and it doesn't understand the 32-bit binary
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[15:18] <nenad> :(
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[15:18] <fwc> lol
[15:19] <fwc> guess slamd stopped doing releases?:P
[15:19] <jescis> fwc, CPU: AMD Sempron(tm)   2600+, Vid Card: ATI Radeon 9550, driver: what ever X initially uses with that card(has to switch to the highest settings every time I restart X/kdm/kde),
[15:19] <fwc> does slack have multilib on the install disc?
[15:20] <thrice`> no
[15:20] <macman_> anyone used dd_rescure to recover stuff ie vob files etc .. ?
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[15:20] <jescis> Hello antiwire :-)
[15:21] <fwc> jescis: ok, i need to know what driver is listed in your xorg config file (/etc/X11/xorg.conf).. also, what resolution/codec is the avi file youre trying to play? and what player are you using?
[15:21] <fwc> if your computer actually freezes its quite possibly a hardware problem
[15:24] <jescis> it's using the radeon driver, fwc
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[15:26] <deximat> Love slackware, I am back, dont like opensolaris
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[15:27] <fwc> jescis: it says "radeon" in /etc/X11/xorg.conf?
[15:27] <InspectorCluseau> IMO once you use and get used to Slack all others seem to suck
[15:27] <CcSsNET> i say the same for sourcemage
[15:27] <CcSsNET> :D
[15:28] <thrice`> we don't care
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[15:29] <beatzz> is there a "slackware" way to setup a dhcp server?
[15:29] <beatzz> i have a box with 2 eth's
[15:29] <beatzz> and i would like to make it the router / firewall
[15:29] <fwc> jescis: if that's the case i believe thats one of the open source drivers.. what version of Slack are you using? still need to know if its a large video, what player youre using, and how much ram you have.... i already told you what infowould be useful, getting it is like pulling teeth though :P
[15:29] <jescis> fwc, line 116-120: Identifier  "Card0" Driver      "radeon" VendorName  "Unknown Vendor" BoardName   "Unknown Board" BusID       "PCI:1:0:0
[15:30] <fwc> jescis: k, how about the other stuff? ram? video size? slackversion?
[15:30] <jescis> slack 13.0
[15:30] <fwc> beatz: yeah edit dhcpd.conf :P
[15:30] <beatzz> thats it?
[15:30] <beatzz> it will handle it from there?
[15:30] <beatzz> i dont need any rc.scripts or anthing more packages?
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[15:31] <ccfreak2k> GCC 4.5 adds support for Intel Atom specific optimizations.
[15:31] <ccfreak2k> Slackware uses 4.3.3 currently.
[15:31] <beatzz> because i know what to do w/ dhcpd.conf but after editing the file that machine will be a dhcp server?
[15:31] <ccfreak2k> I might be waiting a while.
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[15:31] <fwc> beatz: proper place for services in slack is /etc/rc.d/rc.inet2
[15:31] <jescis> 1GB ram, and video size varies... but it's usually a 20-30 min. video >.>
[15:32] <jescis> ^ fwc
[15:32] <fwc> beatz: you can make your own dhcpd start/stop script or just make it start on boot
[15:32] <fwc> jescis, ok.. you might have a hardware problem, id try disabling AGP extensions first
[15:32] <fwc> jescis.. i assume this is an AGP card, not PCI?
[15:33] <jescis> fwc, correct
[15:33] <deximat> Is there any open source driver that could compete Nvidia?
[15:34] <ccfreak2k> noveau?
[15:34] <fwc> deximat, for what card and what purpose?
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[15:34] <deximat> fwc I would like to support my card fully, so I get 3D and some nice res
[15:34] <jescis> fwc, my mobo is a MSI km4m-v btw
[15:34] <fwc> jescis: where it says Driver "radeon" in your xorg.conf try adding - Option "BusType" "PCI"
[15:35] <deximat> fwc, my is GeForce G105M
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[15:35] <adamk_> deximat, There is no open source driver for nvidia cards that supports reasonable 3D acceleration.
[15:35] <fwc> ^ that
[15:36] <fwc> are you having problems with nvidias binary blob? ive had good luck with it
[15:36] <adamk_> deximat, There is 'nv' which is maintained by nvidia, is pretty obfuscated, and has no 3D acceleration.  There is nouveau, which is reverse engineered, provides EXA and Xv support on most (all?)  nvidia GPUs but, last I heard, doesn't provide any more 3D acceleration than is necessary for many of the mesa demos.
[15:37] <deximat> nv is opensource?
[15:37] <sahk0> nv is crap
[15:37] <fwc> jescis: im not worried about the length of the video.. are you trying to play 1080p on that thing and wondering why it lags up?or?
[15:37] <deximat> :)
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[15:37] <sahk0> use vesa instead
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[15:38] <agentc0re> fwc: lol, are you irc'ing with root?
[15:38] <fwc> jescis: and you cant kill X when that happens? alt+ctrl+backspace? or switch to a console alt+ctrl+f2
[15:38] <fwc> agent: yeah :P
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[15:38] <sahk0> slackboy: kick him boy!
[15:38] <fwc> agent, why you gonna h4x0r me over the int3rwebs?
[15:38] <Pig_Pen> the nvidia framebuffer driver conflicts with nvidia's driver so you better select vesa for framebuffer if you intend to use nvidia's driver for X
[15:39] <jescis> fwc, how? "radeon bustype PCI" or "radeon" "bustype PCI" or "radeon" "bustype" "PCI"?
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[15:39] <fwc> jescis: no, add a line: Option "BusType" "PCI"
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[15:40] <jescis> fwc, oh ok
[15:40] <fwc> AGP is essentially PCI with some additions, that will stop it from using some AGP specific stuff
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[15:40] <fwc> and iirc that board is a KM400
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[15:40] <fwc> i just stopped using a KT4VL :P
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[15:42] <jescis> fwc, I know it's a km400
[15:42] <jescis> it's just a good board
[15:42] <goarilla> AGP is bidirectional bus
[15:42] <goarilla> PCI*
[15:43] <goarilla> AGP is unidirectionally weighted
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[15:43] <fwc> k well id do that, and turn off anything "performance enhancing" in BIOS wrt AGP.. fastwrites should be able to be turned off via software
[15:43] <fwc> goar.. yes, but its still essentially PCI
[15:43] <fwc> jescis, but id turn them off in bios anyway.. set your AGP multiplier down, fastwrites off, etc
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[15:44] <jescis> fwc, cause it can't be handled by the frtee driver?
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[15:45] <fwc> jescis, no it *should*, but sometimes it doesnt work, so id do it in bios too just to make sure
[15:45] <fwc> putting BusType PCI should also implicitly turn off fastwrites along with any other AGP features
[15:48] <fwc> too bad youre not in NY, id give you a 7600GS or an X1650Pro :P theyre sitting on top of the computer doing nothing
[15:49] <fwc> well i guess youd want the socket 754 board + A64 3400+ too.. heh :P
[15:49] <jescis> fwc, I would :-)
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[15:51] <deximat> is it possible to use my domain deximat.com as my local and global domain and to make my local network to be accessible as global? on wan?
[15:51] Action: jescis has a low/fixed income and can't do much in this small swank town they call "City of Paducah,KY" ;P
[15:51] <fwc> so weird, i used to talk to people from there like 10 years ago :P
[15:52] <jescis> fwc, I would move... but it's a bitch to do so on a fixed income ;-)
[15:53] <fwc> jescis, if you were worried about swap causing the problem.. it shouldnt, program should gracefully fail if you run out of ram+'virtual memory'
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[15:53] <fwc> ie the kernel should kick it to the curb, but weird stuff can happen sometimes..
[15:53] <jescis> and I moved here in 2005 >.>
[15:54] <fwc> hah
[15:54] <fwc> well id try what i said and see what happens, if not.. its possible you have a faulty/overheating video card or other component
[15:54] <jescis> I lived in Hampton, VA for 25 years before going to this pathetic dump >.> ;-)
[15:55] <fwc> which would be my first suspect, and easy enough to diagnose.. touch some heatsinks and see if you get burned :P
[15:55] <fwc> haha
[15:55] <fwc> i live about 60 miles north of NYC.. its expensive and theres no work :P
[15:55] <jescis> fwc, it'
[15:55] <jescis> s the same here for the work.
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[15:57] <jescis> fwc, btw... I'm also using xine
[15:57] <fwc> id try disabling sound too
[15:57] <fwc> remove your sound modules
[15:58] <jescis> fwc, what about postprocessing?
[15:58] <jescis> should it be disabled?
[15:58] <fwc> why would you have it on?
[15:59] <fwc> it shouldnt hurt anything, but turn it off.. itll just eat cpu
[15:59] <fwc> and you dont exactly have a lot of cpu to waste
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[16:01] <fwc> but yeah, disableall agp "performance" options in the bios, add that line to your xorg.conf, modprobe -r whatever the module name is for your sound card, probably has ac97 in the name
[16:02] <fwc> could probably modprobe -r snd_pcm, that should get rid of most of them - shooooooooooooooooooooooooooopowerpnt
[16:02] <fwc> wow this keyboard is gay
[16:02] <fwc> ^ it loves doing that
[16:03] <fwc> then try playing video, if youre still having problems id say most likely hardware issues
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[16:04] <fwc> if on the other hand it works, try loading up your sound modules again and see if its still ok
[16:04] <jescis> fwc, everything's off board hardware... I have an AudioPCI sound card and of course the video card ;-)
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[16:08] <fwc> same advice. :P
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[16:13] <LnxSlck> hello happy slackers
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[16:43] Nick change: Urchlay_ -> Urchlay
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[16:47] <macman_> does anyone use growisfos from the command line ? .. im trying to burn a dvd and i never can .. growisofs -dvd-compat -Z /dev/hdc -dvd-video -V LABEL /path/to/dvd/image/  any thingi try says write failed . . yet if i run dvd_decryptor in wine and burn the iso to dvd it is fine .. any ideas on how to fixd ?
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[16:49] <thrice`> if it's encrypted, growisofs obviously will not un-encrypt it
[16:50] <goarilla> isn't growisofs for creating iso's
[16:50] <goarilla> so he would need cdrecord for burning no ?
[16:50] <goarilla> ooow wait
[16:51] <goarilla> misunderstood the question it seems, yes growisofs is not a dvd decryptor since
[16:51] <alienBOB> macman_: in #videolan you told us that you were on ubuntu. Why should we be helping you here in ##slackware ?
[16:51] <goarilla> you can't distribute that to everyone since it's illegal in some places to decrypt
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[16:52] <rworkman> busted
[16:52] <goarilla> your best bet would be to search the doom9 forums for an appropriate linux solution/alternative to dvd_decryptor
[16:52] <rworkman> ...down on Bourbon Street.  Set up, like a bowling pin.  Knocked down, it gets to wearing thin, they just won't let you be....
[16:54] <mancha> i understand shopping around for "smart" channels, but why lie :/
[16:55] <Pig_Pen> macman_ should change his nick to crackman
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[17:00] <vhann> Is there someone who's familiar with apache-ant and openJDK? (I'm having issues installing them)
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[17:01] <macman_> omg
[17:01] <macman_> alienBOB, if ubuntu isn't answering where do i go ?
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[17:01] <thrice`> figure it out yourself
[17:01] <macman_> alienBOB, having more chans open and asking people will get you an answer faster
[17:02] <macman_> growisofs isn't a ubuntu thing
[17:02] <macman_> its a linux thing ?
[17:02] <thrice`> it's not a slackware thing either
[17:02] <goarilla> maybe if there isn't any additional anti copy protection on it one could use dd ? --> untested suggestion tho
[17:02] <adaptr> goarilla: I suggest dvdrip
[17:02] <vhann> vobcopy
[17:03] <adaptr> whatever, dd would keep the UDF filesystem intact, which is sorta useless
[17:03] <macman_> thrice`, most peole i talk to in #slackware respond faster and mostly all comands are quick and paintles .. ideling in other chans waiting for an answer is waisting time .. im also googeling while im ideling
[17:03] <goarilla> is he trying to rip a movie or copy a dvd ?
[17:03] <adaptr> unsure
[17:03] <macman_> s/peole/people
[17:03] <thrice`> macman_, regardless, you don't use slackware
[17:04] <macman_> ok
[17:04] <goarilla> propbably the first
[17:04] <goarilla> or he's trying to copy a dvd but he wants to lose the encryption ?
[17:04] <adaptr> macman_: I suggest #growisofs
[17:04] <thrice`> and, really, I don't believe your googling.  you can't find ANYTHINg regarding copy protection of dvds online?
[17:04] <macman_> wow there is a chan for that
[17:04] <macman_> hmm
[17:05] <adaptr> thrice`: indeed, he's just lazy
[17:05] <adaptr> macman_: doom9.net. go
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[17:05] <macman_> thanks adaptr
[17:06] <mancha> it's all spam after 1/1/2010  :) so says SA
[17:06] <adaptr> true
[17:06] <goarilla> SA ?
[17:07] <adaptr> Spam As A Sin
[17:07] <alienBOB> macman_: if you expect from us that you should get your answers here, then I propose to you that you ditch Ubuntu and switch to Slackware.
[17:07] <macman_> :P
[17:07] <goarilla> lol how very christian of you alienBOB and i do mean that literalyl
[17:08] <Pig_Pen> macman_: you know how annoying it is to us when we try to help someone only to find out they are not using slackware on bare metal or using a different distro, when the answer we give will indeed work great on slackware (installed to bare metal) but only to find it it is not working because either they are using a different distro or are using slackware in a virtualized environment on something else?
[17:08] <goarilla> it's time for a CRUSADE
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[17:08] <goarilla> 1 gabloen for every convert
[17:08] <adaptr> bring it on, templarboi
[17:09] <goarilla> maybe in a few decades we have "a rabbi, a priest and a slackware missionary are sitting in a bar" jokes :)
[17:10] Action: alienBOB is better at wielding a bfg1000
[17:10] <macman_> havne't got flammed in years
[17:10] <macman_> 0_o
[17:10] <alienBOB> goarilla: this is still ##slackware, not ##linux
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[17:10] <goarilla> hhhehehehe
[17:11] <nachox> i dont see the joke
[17:11] <goarilla> linus once joked that world domination was his goal
[17:12] <adaptr> why would it be a joke ? RMS has been clamoring that for years, and he never got as far as Linus did
[17:12] <pprkut>  macman_: you are far away from getting flamed.
[17:12] <adaptr> the moral is, apparently: make stuff that works, and world domination is yours
[17:12] <nachox> adaptr, that would be because  RMS is a joke :P
[17:13] <alienBOB> RMS believes in his own dogmas, that is the difference adaptr
[17:13] <adaptr> and if you make stuff that sounds great but doesn't work, you grow a wild, unruly beard and hide out in a cav^H^Huniversity
[17:13] <alienBOB> One ^H too little
[17:13] <adaptr> you never went to cuniversity ?
[17:13] <arcfide> I wonder, what would you get if you put Linux, Theo de Raadt, and Richard Stallman all in the same room and forced them to write an Operating System together? I don't know, but it sure would be entertaining.
[17:13] <alienBOB> Not yet but I want to
[17:14] <macman_> pprkut, i know that
[17:14] <arcfide> s/Linux/Linus/
[17:14] <goarilla> i think it would resemble "das experiment"
[17:14] <arcfide> And why not make the head host of said game show Pat?
[17:14] <nachox> he does far more than believing in them, he acts upon them, for that he earnt my respect despite not sharing his views. he is now using a completely open mips based laptop
[17:14] <adaptr> arcfide: Linus would say "pay me more", Theo would say "pay me more than him" and RMS would say "die infidels!"
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[17:14] <goarilla> alienBOB: how old r you ?
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[17:16] <Pig_Pen> lol @ "die infidels"
[17:16] <macman_> hmm.. i tried slackware 10.0 a while back and got lost .. i rmed it and been on every other distro since then
[17:16] <alienBOB> goarilla: jfgi
[17:16] <goarilla> 28
[17:16] <nachox> haha
[17:16] <alienBOB> macman_: 10.0 is _very_ old
[17:16] <macman_> yea
[17:16] <macman_> :P
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[17:17] <adaptr> so basically.. 10.0 popped your cherry and you've been slagging it ever since ?
[17:17] <macman_> actaully redhat poped by cherry
[17:17] <adaptr> so much for fidelity
[17:17] <macman_> redhat 6 :P
[17:18] <nachox> if you got pissed at rh6 you should have tried the 7.x series...
[17:18] <alienBOB> The rh8 was good
[17:18] <Pig_Pen> 10.0 did not use any lube and did not give him a reach around ;p
[17:18] <adaptr> I permanently ditched RH at 7.3
[17:18] <nachox> there was no part of it that was not broken i think.
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[17:18] <macman_> im looking for a livecd
[17:19] <adaptr> in fact, I never got there, the upgrade from 7.2 was that broken
[17:19] <nachox> they've improved since they released rhel
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[17:21] <macman_> is slackware.com down ?
[17:21] <qneo> macman_: no
[17:21] <alienBOB> What link are you trying
[17:21] <macman_> yea i found it
[17:21] <goarilla> alienBOB: you're 48
[17:22] <alienBOB> Took you long enough
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[17:22] <goarilla> and dutch speaking like me
[17:22] <adaptr> oh noes!
[17:22] <macman_> lucky enough i have a spare parition to try slackware
[17:22] <macman_> :P
[17:22] <goarilla> i'm nto gonna speak dutch have been warned against that more than enough
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[17:23] <nachox> these days you dont even need that, virtualbox or vmware would do too
[17:23] <Pig_Pen> if you get frustrated and give up in less than a day whats the point?
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[17:23] <nachox> Pig_Pen, generating CO2 by transmiting useless data over the internet
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[17:24] <macman_> there a live cd for slackware .. im lookin on slackware.com don't see anything?
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[17:24] <goarilla> no there isn't
[17:24] <macman_> also on livecdlist.com
[17:25] <goarilla> but there are live cd derivatives
[17:25] <Pig_Pen> if you want a slackwareish sort of flavored live CD try slax
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[17:25] <goarilla> slax and backtrack come to mind
[17:25] <egregor> salix, zen os too...
[17:25] <macman_> i have installed backtrack before
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[17:25] <pprkut> backtrack is not slackware based (anymore)
[17:25] <goarilla> yes the 4 release is debian
[17:25] <goarilla> sadly
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[17:26] <Rat409> vectorlinux also a derivative
[17:26] <goarilla> does it have a live cd Rat409 ?
[17:26] <pprkut> goarilla: no, thankfully
[17:26] <goarilla> you don't like it pprkut ?
[17:26] <Rat409> yes,afaik
[17:27] <alienBOB> However macman_ ... we will not be helping you with support for any of these derivatives either, should you encounter problems... just install Slackware
[17:27] <Pig_Pen> Absolute Linux is based on slackware, made to be easy to use, you should give that a try macman_
[17:27] <goarilla> there is also KateOS iirc
[17:27] <goarilla> also easy to use
[17:28] <Pig_Pen> but if you have the cajones and patience to learn slackware you will not regret it
[17:28] <hitest> macman_: I would read up on the slackbook, do your homework and give Slackware a try.
[17:28] <pprkut> goarilla: do you know how many bastards, errr users came in here asking for solutions to problems on Slackware, which were actually bt issues?
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[17:29] <pprkut> they are all gone now \o/
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[17:29] <arcfide> Hrm, is there a keyboard with SCIM on Slackware that let's me type proper English diacritical marks and things like appropriate ellipsis and quotation marks?
[17:29] <arcfide> Right now I can use the RAW Code keyboard to type them in manually, but I'd prefer to avoid that if there is something like the "International English" keyboard available.
[17:29] <Pig_Pen> since backtrack switched to boobuntu they all disapeared (whew!)
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[17:30] <goarilla> is it ubuntu ?
[17:31] <goarilla> if so i have lost all my respect
[17:31] <Pig_Pen> yup, bt switched to the boobuntu
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[17:35] <Ignacio_> arcfide, you'll have to compile that i'm affraid. i also think that the www.scim-im.org web page is down
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[17:40] <macman_> ha i remember why i gave up on slack also .. i think i had an issue running XFree86 .. i could never get my reslution / get into X
[17:41] <Ignacio_> xfree? hehe, can you say old?
[17:41] <jg71> no
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[17:42] <macman_> lol Ignacio_ told you its been a minute
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[17:46] <macman_> so ubuntu and slackware ... slackware is true linux and ubuntu a derivitate of debian .. what is the diffrence its all linux
[17:47] <pprkut> hah, you wish
[17:47] <sitwon> What does that mean, "true linux"?
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[17:48] <sitwon> are you referring to the fact that Slackware uses the vanilla kernel and Ubuntu has a heavily patched kernel?
[17:48] <macman_> yes sounds right sitwon
[17:48] <mancha> *yawn*  distro flames are so 2009
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[17:48] <alienBOB> Every distro has its own philosophy about what it should offer... so it chooses its own end user population
[17:48] <goarilla> which patches does ubuntu apply ?
[17:49] <goarilla> just out of curiousity
[17:49] Action: Camarade_Tux is tempted to say "random ones"
[17:49] <pprkut> lol
[17:49] <sitwon> goarilla: a lot. go check their LP
[17:49] <goarilla> LP ?
[17:49] <sitwon> Launchpad
[17:49] <pprkut> Camarade_Tux: those starting with a letter that fits the current release
[17:49] <sitwon> they use LP for their source repository
[17:49] <goarilla> wth is that
[17:49] <goarilla> k
[17:50] <alienBOB> Slackware's philosophy is to not use patches to change software's functionality to make it "fit" better with Slackware unless it is unavoidable
[17:50] <Camarade_Tux> pprkut: ah, that's the rule! I had been wondering for years, good to know ;p
[17:50] <pprkut> :D
[17:50] <sitwon> alienBOB: like changing the lilo boot screen to black?
[17:51] <macman_> well i can try slack .. i just want something that works .. im not afraid to use the command line
[17:51] <Ignacio__> macman_, slackware is actually a derivative of an earlier distro
[17:51] <macman_> Ignacio__, of what distro ?
[17:51] <Camarade_Tux> SLS
[17:51] Nick change: Ignacio__ -> nachox
[17:51] <goarilla> yes but back in the SLS
[17:52] <goarilla> wasn't slackware the patched* version of SLS ?
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[17:52] <sitwon> blasphemy! slackware was written out bit-for-bit by Bob Dobbs
[17:52] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: branding, you won't really see branding in slackware (like changing the KDE icon for its start menu), lilo is an exception (and a much needed one : the red background was really awful ;p )
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[17:53] <macman_> suse came from slack
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[17:53] <macman_>  ?
[17:53] <macman_> wow
[17:53] <sitwon> Camarade_Tux: yea, I know. I saw Pat's comment on the change.
[17:53] <nachox> it's earlier versions did, then they switched to using rpms
[17:53] <goarilla> which made it suck imho
[17:54] <alienBOB> It was not Pat who wanted this lilo bootsplash you know ;-) It was peer pressure
[17:54] <sitwon> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8c/Gldt.svg
[17:54] <macman_> i actually feel bad now .. im looking at the wikipeida grpah of what came from what .. ubuntu is a baby
[17:55] <goarilla> slackware is the oldest still maintained distro of linux
[17:55] <sitwon> alienBOB: I always changed it myself anyays. Even now I'm not using the stock image, I like the upsidedown version of the logo better
[17:56] <sitwon> I was really hoping he'd stick with that reversible logo
[17:56] <alienBOB> sitwon: the "slackwars" one?
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[17:56] <Pig_Pen> the flippy logo
[17:56] <Pig_Pen> it was cool
[17:56] <sitwon> alienBOB: yea, that one ;-)
[17:56] <alienBOB> A lot of people were really aggressive towards Pat about this logo, and all it was meant to be was a bit of fun. People took it far too seriously
[17:56] <macman_> how long do you think slackware will be around more ?
[17:57] <Camarade_Tux> alienBOB: well, the previous red background had an advantage: you could tell a slackware a kilometer away ;-)
[17:57] <alienBOB> macman_: who knows. Who cares. Live by the day
[17:57] <sitwon> macman_: until Pat V. dies
[17:57] <macman_> alienBOB,  like i said i just want something that works and i can get support
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[17:57] Action: Camarade_Tux still needs to buy a reversible slackware sticker for his laptop, it'll always be upside-up and downside-down :-) 
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[17:58] <goarilla> yeah right
[17:58] <goarilla> like ubuntu has good SUPPORT
[17:58] <goarilla> you're still on irc and relying on 'community help'
[17:58] <alienBOB> macman_: Slackware will die if Pat no longer gets enough money to keep his family alive
[17:58] <sitwon> RedHad has.... "support"
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[17:58] <goarilla> yes and SuSE as well
[17:58] <sitwon> s/RedHad/RedHat/
[17:58] <goarilla> but you pay for it
[17:59] <Pig_Pen> we should get Pat
[17:59] <sitwon> goarilla: he never said "free support"
[17:59] <goarilla> no but he runs ubuntu
[18:00] <sitwon> goarilla: which also has commercial support available (though Canonical and others)
[18:00] <Pig_Pen> we should get Pat's DNA had have a scientist clone a million Pat's and put them to work developing slackware (we can rulez t3h world!)
[18:00] <goarilla> yeah yeah yeah sitwon
[18:00] <goarilla> but i don't trust ubuntu support
[18:01] <Camarade_Tux> Pig_Pen: hehe :P
[18:01] <goarilla> they don't do a lot that benefits linux
[18:01] <sitwon> why should you? the average Slackware user could probably replace five of their technicians
[18:01] <goarilla> just ask GKH
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[18:01] <sitwon> GKH?
[18:01] <goarilla> Greg-Kroah Hartman
[18:01] <goarilla> or something like thatr
[18:01] <sitwon> ah
[18:01] <Camarade_Tux> Greg Kroah, bah, too slow
[18:01] <goarilla> but pat should get a european bank account
[18:02] <sitwon> I was thinking of someone else who has the same initials
[18:02] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: iirc he made a presentation showing canonical didn't contribute to upstream projects
[18:02] <goarilla> we dont use checks in europe and we also don't use credit cards a lot
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[18:02] <Camarade_Tux> well, I do use my credit card
[18:03] <goarilla> i don't thrust it its security model is very weak
[18:03] <goarilla> although there are more modern version with PIN numbers
[18:03] <Camarade_Tux> what do you trust?
[18:03] <goarilla> IBAN bank deposits
[18:03] <sitwon> Camarade_Tux: 2nd amendment
[18:03] <macman_> question .. if i installed slackware and i need libdvdcss other 3rd party stuff .. is there a repo for slackware somewhere ?
[18:04] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: ?
[18:04] <Urchlay> macman_: www.slackbuilds.org
[18:04] <sitwon> that's what he trusts, good ol' 2nd
[18:04] <alienBOB> You'll find thre are several repos of packages, as well as repos of package build scripts
[18:04] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: except it's not very practical, how do you get cash, how do you pay for something that's 50 euros?
[18:05] <goarilla> what does the right to bear arms have to do with int. payments
[18:05] <sitwon> Camarade_Tux: if you have a bigger gun, what make you think you _need_ to pay?
[18:05] <alienBOB> I pay my slackware-subscription using credit card. In Europe there is no other way to support Slackware
[18:05] <goarilla> idd alienBOB and it's the main reason i haven't paid my dues
[18:06] <mario> hey, speaking of, how much does it cost to order t-shirt from store.slackware.com, and get it shipped to europe !?
[18:06] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: for me, the second amendment is: Modification de la date des sessions parlementaires :-)
[18:06] <goarilla> date* ?
[18:07] <Camarade_Tux> mario: shipment is quite expensive =/
[18:07] <sitwon> Camarade_Tux: ah... your countries 2nd amendment is rather useless then.
[18:07] <goarilla> you can change the date of parlements sessions ?
[18:07] <mario> Camarade_Tux: well how much is it ?!
[18:07] <sitwon> at least in the given situation
[18:08] <hiptobecubic> Is there anyone other than dell that offers anything with anything other than windows on it?
[18:08] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: yes
[18:08] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: if yours is the right to bear arms when going to the butcher, I better not say anything about it ;-)
[18:08] <Camarade_Tux> mario: can't remember exactly =/
[18:08] <hiptobecubic> sitwon, go on?
[18:09] <mario> Camarade_Tux well was it 2x the price or what ?
[18:09] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: Lenovo, HP, EmpororLinux, ...some others I've forgotten...
[18:09] <Camarade_Tux> I've seen some shop ship in low-priority for very low rates though recently, dunno if that'd apply to the slackware shop
[18:09] <Urchlay> emperorlinux is still in business? cool
[18:09] <Camarade_Tux> mario: less than twice but not small either
[18:10] <sitwon> http://www.system76.com/
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[18:10] <hiptobecubic> sitwon, unless you're talking about proliant servers running SLES, you can take HP off that list. Couldn't find anything on Lenovo's site either
[18:10] <sitwon> http://emperorlinux.com/
[18:10] Action: Camarade_Tux hopes slackytude joined
[18:10] <Camarade_Tux> anyone has looooooong backlogs? like several months?
[18:10] <goarilla> lenovo does have ... compatibility list for RHEL
[18:10] <Ignacio_> Camarade_Tux, irc?
[18:10] <goarilla> but yes
[18:10] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: they offered OpenSUSE on some T400 and T500 systems as recently as 6 months ago (maybe not to consumers, however)
[18:11] <hiptobecubic> "not to consumers" ?
[18:11] <Camarade_Tux> Ignacio_: yes
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[18:11] <Ignacio_> Camarade_Tux, this channel has public logs, it has had them for many years
[18:11] <goarilla> has anyone tried to get the windows 7 license price charged back ?
[18:11] <Camarade_Tux> Ignacio_: slackytude got a shirt and I'm sure he mentionned it here
[18:11] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: They offer them to business customers but maybe not "home" customers
[18:11] <Pig_Pen> i never log this stuff, as soon as it leaves the buffer it disapears forever (on my machine)
[18:11] <Camarade_Tux> Ignacio_: easily downloadable? I'd need them over 6 month
[18:11] <Camarade_Tux> s
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[18:12] <Ignacio_> Camarade_Tux, yes
[18:12] <Ignacio_> google for it
[18:12] Action: Camarade_Tux pats slackboy 
[18:12] <sitwon> gamepc.com offers several distros
[18:14] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/workstations/thinkstation/d10-s10/tech_specs
[18:14] <sitwon> Workstations w/ RHEL 5
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[18:15] <hiptobecubic> damn emperor is expensive :)
[18:15] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: is there something in particular you're looking for?
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[18:16] <Urchlay> hiptobecubic: yah, I always wondered how he managed to stay in business, but he's been around for what, 11 or 12 years now?
[18:16] <alienBOB> Camarade_Tux: see the topic
[18:16] <hiptobecubic> a run of the mill laptop like any normal user would buy, minus buying yet another windows license of which i have several
[18:17] <sitwon> Urchlay: seems like he does a pretty good job with the integration, a few years ago I grabed some of his sources/patches to fix some issues on one of my laptops
[18:17] <Camarade_Tux> alienBOB: yeah, already downloading the logs but it'll take some time before I get everything
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[18:18] <hiptobecubic> These companies are all acting like no one has ever purchased a computer before. Does everyone really need another mouse, keyboard, and monitor with every computer? Would you buy photoshop CS4 again just because you bought a new computer? No. You'd just install it because you already have it.
[18:18] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: I'd buy from the Lenovo Outlet and then sell the windows license or ask Microsoft for a refund
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[18:18] <hiptobecubic> Microsoft doesn't offer refunds and neither does lenovo.
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[18:18] <Camarade_Tux> hiptobecubic: you can refuse the EULA
[18:18] <sitwon> still, the prices in the Lenovo Outlet are pretty good
[18:18] <hiptobecubic> and HP goes so far as voiding your warranty if you don't use windows. or at least they did
[18:19] <hiptobecubic> Camarade_Tux, yes but you can't necessarily keep the computer and refuse the software.
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[18:19] <hiptobecubic> If they are sold together.
[18:19] <Camarade_Tux> hiptobecubic: where do you live?
[18:19] <hiptobecubic> US
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[18:20] <Camarade_Tux> hiptobecubic: well, here, that'd be "forced selling" (if that's a proper translation of "vente forcée") which is illegal
[18:20] <Camarade_Tux> ergh, vente liée, so linked selling
[18:20] <goarilla> we call it 'coupling sale'
[18:20] <hiptobecubic> I just looked at the EULA for win7 oem and it says it's up to the manufacturer if they are going to do partial refund or not.
[18:20] <Camarade_Tux> I should go to bed
[18:20] <egregor> venda casada
[18:21] <hiptobecubic> Well in the US we call it "capitalism" apparently because that's how it works here.
[18:21] <Camarade_Tux> hiptobecubic: yeah, they changed that in win7 because more and more people were asking for a refund (not many but the number was certainly going to increase even more)
[18:21] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: I'd talk to a Lenovo representative. They know a lot of their customers are running Linux and I've never had an issue getting warranty service on my ThinkPads
[18:21] <hiptobecubic> hmm
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[18:23] <Camarade_Tux> hiptobecubic: in Europe (France?), we call it anti-trust and anti-anti-competition measures
[18:23] <macman_> another n00b distro question :P slackware 13 does it come with mostly all packages ? ie like unrestricstions or something ?
[18:23] <hiptobecubic> well we have anti-trust laws here also, it's just tough to get them enforced
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[18:24] Nick change: Ignacio_ -> nachox
[18:24] <hiptobecubic> macman_, not sure what you mean? You mean does it come with drivers and things that slackware is not allowed to distribute? no
[18:24] <alienBOB> macman_: any examples you have in mind?
[18:24] <macman_> yes
[18:24] <Pig_Pen> i think all hardware (both desktops & laptops) should be OS agnostic, so it should not matter if it is BSD, Linux, Solarus or windows
[18:24] <macman_> alienBOB, ubuntu has ubnutn-restricsitons .. its gives you flash and some other stuff
[18:24] <alienBOB> Somethings are not bundled macman_ ... like indeed flash, nvidia & ati proprietary drivers
[18:24] <sitwon> macman_: most of that is available in the SBo repository
[18:25] <alienBOB> And libdvdcss etc
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[18:25] <alienBOB> But, you can get those effortlessly
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[18:25] <Camarade_Tux> alienBOB: what about xv?
[18:25] <sahk0> sitwon: the SBo repository of scripts :p
[18:25] <sitwon> macman_: you have to install those manually because Copyright law does not allow Pat to distribute them
[18:26] <sitwon> sahk0: I know, but the scripts to build the packages that he wants...
[18:26] <sitwon> and sbopkg makes it as easy as using Synaptics
[18:26] <sahk0> yeah, in some cases people hear repository go to sbo and downlad some tarball and try to install it. :p
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[18:27] <alienBOB> Camarade_Tux: the xv author is a personal friend of Pat. And, you are free to distribute xv
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[18:28] <Camarade_Tux> alienBOB: ok, I don't really use xv (gpicview is all I need/want for my images) and I wasn't sure about the licence
[18:28] <hitest> macman_: the how to on slackbuildsorg is straight forward
[18:29] <hitest> slackbuilds.org
[18:29] <macman_> yea .. oh trust me im going to try slackware .. i need to backup all stuff first ..
[18:29] Action: macman_ hates virtualization
[18:29] <hitest> good idea
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[18:30] Action: goarilla loves it
[18:31] <sitwon> virtualization makes my life soooooo much easier.
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[18:31] <pprkut> vbox ftw!
[18:31] <goarilla> hear hear *
[18:32] <goarilla> for desktop virtualisation it really is the best i've come to use
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[18:32] <macman_> ok
[18:32] <macman_> i will give it ago
[18:32] <macman_> bbl
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[18:33] <Camarade_Tux> pprkut: kvm is nice too :-)
[18:33] <goarilla> and i have used qemu, vmware server 1.x and 2.x and vbox
[18:33] <goarilla> qemu-kvm ?
[18:33] <goarilla> i thought kvm was like vt
[18:33] <goarilla> but then kernel side
[18:33] <goarilla> there's also xen but the commercial backing of that (citrix) turns me off
[18:33] <Camarade_Tux> kvm uses hardware vt
[18:34] <pprkut> Camarade_Tux: I'm somewhat biased ;)
[18:34] <hiptobecubic> qemu-kvm is qemu using kvm
[18:34] <goarilla> so it is kvm ?
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[18:34] <goarilla> also iirc
[18:34] <goarilla> virtualbox also forked of qemu
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[18:34] <hiptobecubic> I'm not sure i could live with the ThinkPad Nub®
[18:34] <goarilla> back in the day when people still used kqemu kernel module as well
[18:35] <goarilla> trackpoint hiptobecubic ?
[18:35] <hiptobecubic> yes
[18:35] <goarilla> i love it ... it's the only thing on laptops that works for me besides an external mouse
[18:35] <pprkut> goarilla: I think it was/is more of a code reuse than a fork
[18:35] <goarilla> or the trackballs on the right top corner
[18:35] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: if you try it I think you'll really like it. If you _really_ don't like it, you can just pull it off and pretend it's not there
[18:35] <goarilla> but they don't that anymore
[18:35] <hiptobecubic> sitwon, well some only have the nub and no pad
[18:36] <goarilla> which ?
[18:36] <goarilla> give me link
[18:36] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: only the X60,X61,X200,X200 Tablet
[18:36] <goarilla> its exactly what i want
[18:36] <goarilla> crap the X series
[18:36] <goarilla> i want a T
[18:36] <sitwon> the X300 and larger all have a touchpad
[18:36] <hiptobecubic> hmm
[18:36] <hiptobecubic> well dang
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[18:36] <goarilla> so only the small bastards have those
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[18:37] <hiptobecubic> goarilla, why the T
[18:37] <sitwon> goarilla: all thinkpads have a trackpoint, but only the 12" screen and smaller don't have a touchpad
[18:37] <Pig_Pen> T T T T what begins with T, Ten Tired Turtles in a Tuttle Tuttle Tree :D
[18:38] <alienBOB> hiptobecubic: the T series has a titanium shell
[18:38] <sitwon> all ThinkPads have the signature full-size, ansi-standard, spill-resistant keyboard
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[18:38] Action: alienBOB loves the thinkpad's trackpoint
[18:38] <hiptobecubic> i haven't tried the trackpoint, it might be nice
[18:39] <alienBOB> Some hal FDI file modifications and the trackpoint can scroll horizontally as well as vertically
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[18:39] <Camarade_Tux> 350MB of IRC logs :P
[18:40] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: it's realyy great, because you can move the mouse and scroll through documents without lifting your hands off they keyboard
[18:40] <fredoslack> Camarade_Tux,  ollééééé
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[18:40] <hiptobecubic> yes that's what i'm seeing
[18:40] <sitwon> hold the middle button and move the nub around to scroll
[18:40] <Camarade_Tux> yoyo fredoslack
[18:41] <sitwon> ThinkPads are the only laptop I've seen with the middle-button for the nub-mouse (Latitudes have a nub-mouse but only two buttons, so you can't scroll w/ them)
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[18:42] <Pig_Pen> ctrl n (for down) ctrl p (for up) scrolling
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[18:43] <Urchlay> spacebar and pageup work fine in firefox and less
[18:43] <Pig_Pen> too bad that only works in links & lynx
[18:43] <Urchlay> spacebar = nice big target, hard to miss
[18:44] <sitwon> also the middle-click button is conveiniently place for pasting in the terminal
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[18:44] <hiptobecubic> alright
[18:45] <goarilla_> yeah right on a lot of mices that is pushing the scroll wheel
[18:45] <goarilla_> with me its on a more convenient place
[18:45] <hiptobecubic> the think pad looks pretty rad
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[18:46] <Pig_Pen> someday laptops will be as thin as paper
[18:46] <Pig_Pen> and can be folded up and put in your pocket
[18:46] <sitwon> Pig_Pen: they already are (if you happen to have some really thick paper)
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[18:47] <sitwon> and really big pockets
[18:47] <goarilla_> :)
[18:47] <sitwon> http://www.openpandora.org
[18:47] <goarilla_> thats not paper sitwon
[18:47] <Pig_Pen> i have an army fatigue jacket with some big pockets
[18:47] <hiptobecubic> DisplayPort? I don't see that taking hold.
[18:47] <goarilla_> offcourse not
[18:47] <hiptobecubic> I had not heard of it until i saw it on this thinkpad
[18:47] <goarilla_> it's apple
[18:48] <goarilla_> it's like firewire
[18:48] <goarilla_> superior tech for its intended purpose
[18:48] <hiptobecubic> "DisplayPort is a digital display interface standard put forth by the Video Electronics Standards Association (VESA) since 2006."
[18:48] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: so far the ThinkPads and MacBooks are the primary adopter of DisplayPort, but I've seen it on some LCD TVs
[18:48] <goarilla_> but they license it way too expensive so it effectively dies on the wide consumer market
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[18:48] <sitwon> goarilla_: It's not Apple, it's an open standard
[18:48] <goarilla_> aaah k
[18:49] <hiptobecubic> I don't have anything that can use it. goarilla_ it's royalty free it says.
[18:49] <goarilla_> so it has a change :D
[18:49] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: it's going to replace DVI and eventually HDMI
[18:49] <sitwon> or it's projected to
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[18:49] <goarilla_> what about those usb monitors
[18:49] <sitwon> There are adapters to convert DisplayPort to DVI, VGA, HDMI, etc.
[18:49] <goarilla_> i really hope those don't catch on
[18:50] <hiptobecubic> sitwon, there are laptops taht have them built in ;)
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[18:50] <sitwon> goarilla_: when we have USB 3.0 there will actually be enough bandwidth for USB monitors to be useful
[18:50] <goarilla_> yeah right
[18:51] <Pig_Pen> time to kill X and enjoy an awesome vesa console
[18:51] <sitwon> hiptobecubic: I guess it depends on what you really need/use.
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[18:51] <Camarade_Tux> Pig_Pen: KMS is nice, which card do you have?
[18:51] <goarilla_> i really hoped firewire catched on
[18:51] <goarilla_> but apple fucked us in the ass
[18:51] <sitwon> Apple seems to think DisplayPort has enough potential that they're using an open standard for once instead of a proprietary connector
[18:51] <Pig_Pen> nvidia, i just use the generic vesa driver so i can use nvidia's driver for X
[18:52] <sitwon> goarilla_: why? firewire was redundant w/ USB
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[18:52] <goarilla_> no it isn't
[18:52] <goarilla_> it designed for large bulk transfers
[18:52] <goarilla_> USB is low latency stuff for input devices
[18:52] <sitwon> goarilla_: yes but with USB 2.0 the effective bandwidth was nearly identical
[18:53] <Camarade_Tux> usb was designed to be lower-cost while firewire was better but more expensive
[18:53] <goarilla_> a firewire disk outperforms a USB 2 disk
[18:53] <goarilla_> in theory sitwon
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[18:53] <goarilla_> and there is firewire800 and 1600
[18:53] <sitwon> and eSATA puts them both to shame
[18:53] Nick change: goarilla_ -> goarilla
[18:53] <Camarade_Tux> a bit like x86 CPUs kicked other CPUs, not because they were faster but because they were cheaper
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[18:53] <sitwon> and soon USB 3.0 will overshadow even eSATA
[18:53] <Camarade_Tux> sitwon: actually, eSATA and USB provide the same speeds
[18:54] <Camarade_Tux> USB3 that is
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[18:54] <goarilla> yeah ... in theory sitwon
[18:54] <goarilla> sata is designed for disks
[18:54] <goarilla> USB3 isn't
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[18:54] <goarilla> and you still need bridges
[18:54] <goarilla> and those add overhead
[18:55] <sitwon> goarilla: how much bandwidth do you actually need?
[18:55] <goarilla> i want to go as close as native on the actual disk
[18:55] <goarilla> esata can do that
[18:55] <goarilla> it's not about available bandwith
[18:56] <hiptobecubic> goarilla, you want to use esata on principle and not functionality?
[18:56] <goarilla> functionality ?
[18:56] <hiptobecubic> speed
[18:56] <goarilla> for mass storage devices it also support hot swap
[18:56] <hiptobecubic> in this case
[18:56] <goarilla> if the controller blablabla ...
[18:57] <goarilla> no esata has been designed to be sata but externally ...
[18:57] <goarilla> so for disks
[18:57] <sitwon> When you're getting up there to the extreme performance requirements any generic solution is going to be inadequate. but USB wins over Firewire, IMHO, because of it's versatility. The slight loss in performance is justified by the fact that it does more than just bulk data transfer.
[18:58] <goarilla> have you ever gotten the 60 MB/s theoretical speed out of a USB2 disk ?
[18:58] <hiptobecubic> well this thinkpad does both
[18:58] <hiptobecubic> goarilla, more like 9
[18:58] <goarilla> it's not a slight loss sitwon
[18:59] <goarilla> i get 27.4 MB/s raw dding a USB2 disk of 1 TB
[18:59] <sitwon> goarilla: it's slight enough that I've never had a problem streaming HD video from USB disks
[18:59] <goarilla> i get 46.7 MB/s doing it on my system disk over EIDE udma 3
[19:00] <goarilla> 80 gb disk
[19:00] <goarilla> quite old !
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[19:00] <goarilla> i'm not evne talking about real word performance here
[19:01] <goarilla> and USB does use a lot of CPU when transferring files
[19:01] <goarilla> it's like using ntfs-3g without ntfs-3g
[19:01] <sitwon> goarilla: for raw performance, you'll always do better with a dedicated solution. But can you use EIDE to connect your keyboard? printer? network card? TV tuner?
[19:01] <hiptobecubic> ntfs-3g is a pretty bad hog
[19:01] <goarilla> sitwon: ... ffs
[19:02] <goarilla> i think we should have adopted firewire for its intended use bulk transfers ...
[19:02] <goarilla> for DV camera's in the past ...
[19:02] <goarilla> and we should use USB for its intended use
[19:02] <goarilla> input devices !
[19:02] <sitwon> goarilla: a lot of laptop still have firewire ports... the R60 I'm using right now has a firewire port
[19:03] <goarilla> yes
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[19:03] <goarilla> but because of apple and because of USB ... and the philisophy of 'it's good enough'
[19:03] <sitwon> Firewire is only "dead" because consumers didn't adopt it, instead choosing the lower cost and more universal USB alternatives
[19:04] <goarilla> the hardware is expensive, hard to find and a lot of times a generation behind
[19:04] <sitwon> A lot of people still buy 5400RPM drives when they could have 7200RPM for only $10 more
[19:04] <goarilla> yes because it's USB
[19:04] <goarilla> it doesn't matter
[19:04] <goarilla> in that case
[19:05] <goarilla> you won't get the performance benefits
[19:05] <sitwon> goarilla: no, I mean even for internal drives
[19:05] <goarilla> i know :D
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[19:06] <goarilla> but with modern disk densities
[19:06] <sitwon> I'd think everyone would be using SSD for their boot drive by now... but a lot of people still boot off of 5400RPM and yet spend hundreds on more RAM and faster CPUs thinking those will make a difference
[19:06] <antiwire> umm
[19:06] <goarilla> for bulk transfers rpm doesn't make that much difference
[19:06] <goarilla> for latency yes
[19:06] <antiwire> there are solid reasons for using 5400RPM disks.
[19:07] <goarilla> yes ... more silent, more durable, less power usage, ...
[19:07] <sitwon> antiwire: would you rather boot from 5400 or Intel SSD?
[19:07] <antiwire> less frictional heat being generated is a big plus for 5400RPM disks
[19:07] <goarilla> that's not a question
[19:07] <goarilla> and until we get a mature solid state fs
[19:07] <antiwire> sitwon: SSD is prohibitively expensive
[19:07] <goarilla> i would rather boot from a mechanical drive
[19:07] <goarilla> like i would be running ext2 on a +100 gig drive
[19:08] <sitwon> goarilla: you don't need a solid state fs, SSDs have built-in wearleveling. adding a wearleveling on top of that will worsen the problem
[19:09] <goarilla> sitwon: are you dismissing the efforts of the butterfs and all the other ssd filesystem devs ?
[19:09] <goarilla> although i dont really know if butterfs was a ssd fs
[19:09] <goarilla> but sitwon can i thrust a ssd to holds its own ??? when used as a system disk ?
[19:09] <goarilla> be aware
[19:10] <goarilla> i have a 4 gig slackware drive i have used for 7 years which i can still boot and use its slackware 11 on
[19:10] <sitwon> antiwire: I disagree. This seems pretty affordable http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820183252
[19:10] <goarilla> it's the reason why slackware hd's are highly praised by me
[19:10] <goarilla> samsung*
[19:11] <antiwire> That's a 16GB disk....
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[19:11] <antiwire> give me a break.
[19:11] <antiwire> I question the real world experience of anyone raising claims like this
[19:11] <goarilla> RiDATA hahhaahahah
[19:11] <sitwon> antiwire: how much disk space are you using (sans /home)?
[19:11] <antiwire> 750GB +
[19:11] <antiwire> and that's just one system.
[19:11] <goarilla> thats like using brother for ... joysticks
[19:12] <antiwire> you're picking a fight with the wrong person when it comes to storage
[19:12] <goarilla> antiwire
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[19:12] <sitwon> goarilla: your worries about the lifespan of the disk are unjustified, SSDs will last longer than traditional hard drives in nearly all usecase excepting an active database server
[19:12] <goarilla> are you running 120 OS'es ?
[19:12] <antiwire> goarilla: How does the number of operating systems even apply here?
[19:12] <goarilla> could be could be but your link on newegg is ridiculous
[19:12] <sitwon> antiwire: I'm not talking about your entire system, I'm just talking about the OS and applications
[19:13] <goarilla> because it's your system disk
[19:13] <goarilla> unless you have like a
[19:13] <sitwon> antiwire: your user data goes on a cheaper spinning disk
[19:13] <goarilla> a mirror and all the sources on it
[19:13] <antiwire> right...and when you have a whole system using "spinning" disks on a hardware raid array...
[19:13] <sitwon> the difference in boot time alone makes it worth it IMHO
[19:13] <antiwire> this is a lame argument fellows. I am done.
[19:14] <goarilla> antiwire: in your experience hw raid or sw raid ?
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[19:14] <antiwire> goarilla: I have done both in mass quantity.
[19:14] <antiwire> It all depends on the requirements of the site/client.
[19:14] <goarilla> i would prefer sw raid for its ... portability
[19:14] <goarilla> and data integrity
[19:14] <goarilla> i was thinking about this
[19:15] <antiwire> you would prefer..that's all fine and well. What about when clients specifications prefer?
[19:15] <sitwon> antiwire: I'm not suggesting you use SSD for bulk storage, jsut for the OS and applications.
[19:15] <sitwon> there's a big difference there
[19:15] <goarilla> ECC registered memory in RAM and ECC registered memory on hw raid card with >=8 sata ports
[19:15] <goarilla> but then i would use software raid
[19:15] <goarilla> only use the hw raid controller for the ECC, staggered spin-off and more ports
[19:15] <goarilla> and bbu
[19:15] <antiwire> goarilla: and you'd consider deploying a volatile setup?
[19:16] <goarilla> whaaa?
[19:16] <antiwire> I think goarilla is also smoking crack.
[19:16] <sitwon> goarilla: why would you use software RAID if you have hardware RAID controller?
[19:17] <goarilla> staggered spin-up, Eror correction from system to card (ECC), multiple ports and backup unit for when system fails
[19:17] <antiwire> goarilla: why are you even talking about the cache of an HBA? we are talking about disks.
[19:17] <antiwire> so are you talking about HBA cache or volatile memory storage systems?
[19:18] <goarilla> ... i can't follow
[19:18] <goarilla> i need a large array of space
[19:18] <goarilla> and integrity
[19:18] <goarilla> of the data
[19:18] <goarilla> and portability if the controller or motherboard goes haywire
[19:18] <antiwire> I have officially lost IQ point for participating in this conversation.
[19:19] <goarilla> why antiwire
[19:19] <CcSsNET> i wasnt here ...
[19:19] <goarilla> ffs
[19:19] <CcSsNET> o right
[19:19] Action: CcSsNET goes back to afk
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[19:21] <goarilla> ok nevermind i'm talking about stuff i haven't gotten the experience for to discuss with you antiwire
[19:21] <goarilla> and you assume i do
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[19:23] <beatzz> how exactly would you set up slackware as a dhcp router
[19:23] <beatzz> i know i gata do something to the route
[19:23] <beatzz> eth1 & eth2
[19:23] <goarilla> a real router runs a routing protocol (BGP,OSPF,RIP, ...)
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[19:24] <beatzz> im basicly looking for a firewall type system
[19:24] <antiwire> beatzz: what do you mean by a "dhcp router" ?
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[19:24] <beatzz> that will move traffic from one end to the other filtering as it dose.
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[19:25] <beatzz> antiwire, i want this computer to hook up to a modem on eth1 and have another computer pluged into eth2
[19:25] <goarilla> yes and then a modem or real router/modem that sends your stuff to the WAN
[19:25] <antiwire> Do you mean a border router doing NAT and serving DNS and DHCP or an internal LAN?
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[19:25] <antiwire> or/for
[19:25] <beatzz> yes
[19:25] <goarilla> mmm beatzz
[19:25] <goarilla> you want a network on eth2 or just a pc ?
[19:26] <beatzz> network
[19:26] <goarilla> because you'll need a crossover cable to ...
[19:26] <beatzz> will put a swith on it
[19:26] <goarilla> ok nevermind
[19:26] <goarilla> thats idd the right way to go
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[19:26] <goarilla> we'll first you'll have to enable forwarding of packets
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[19:26] <beatzz> i did
[19:26] <goarilla> which is a proc settings
[19:26] <antiwire> beatzz: so something like this:  [internet]----[modem]---[eth0 on router with public IP]<>[eth1 on router with private IP]
[19:26] <beatzz> /etc/rc.d/rc.ip_forwarding +x
[19:26] <goarilla> all your clients need to have you setup as their gateway
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[19:27] <beatzz> correct.
[19:27] <antiwire> rc.ip_forward is only part of this
[19:27] <antiwire> you need to setup a NATing script
[19:27] <beatzz> ?
[19:27] <antiwire> ip forwarding is not = to nat
[19:28] <goarilla> yes some snat and dnatting rules in iptables
[19:28] <antiwire> you need iptables rules do to this.
[19:28] <antiwire> to do
[19:28] <jg71> satan will get you
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[19:28] <adaptr> satan will have to wait in line, just like everybody else
[19:29] <goarilla> beatzz: are you familliar with linux ?
[19:29] <antiwire> do also do not necessarily need to focus on snat or dnat.
[19:29] <beatzz> goarilla, yes
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[19:29] <antiwire> something like this should get basic NAT going provided ip forwarding is already working: iptables --table nat --append POSTROUTING --out-interface eth0 -j MASQUERADE  iptables --append FORWARD --in-interface eth1 -j ACCEPT
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[19:30] <antiwire> Next step is reading all you can about dnsmasq
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[19:30] <antiwire> because dnsmasq can do DNS forwarding and dhcpd all in one
[19:31] <antiwire> it will also resolve local, private, ip addresses when setup correctly.
[19:31] <goarilla> fqdn ones ?
[19:31] <antiwire> it will do both.
[19:31] <antiwire> read the damn man page
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[19:32] <antiwire> in fact you can tell it append a local domain or not. it will decide, based upon IP ranges, when to forward out to the internet if need be
[19:33] <antiwire> dnsmasq is what dd-wrt and openwrt both use by default to provide DNS and DHCP for the lan side
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[19:34] <goarilla> i cant use dd-wrt routers
[19:34] <antiwire> ok?
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[19:34] <goarilla> lol
[19:34] <antiwire> I was making a point that dnsmasq will provide the services he needs.
[19:35] <goarilla> yeah i know that and i wanted to say that our internet situation in this country is fucked up.
[19:35] <antiwire> off and a tangent man is going off on a tangent.
[19:35] <alienBOB> Move to NL goarilla
[19:35] <goarilla> i KNOW alienBOB i know
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[19:36] <antiwire> I'd so live in alienBOB's basement. In a heart beat.
[19:36] <goarilla> i rather not
[19:36] <alienBOB> 60 mbit down, 6 mbit up in this house...
[19:36] <antiwire> dang
[19:37] <goarilla> it's getting cold here isn't it :D
[19:37] <goarilla> wij hebben sneeuw
[19:37] <goarilla> ma ni genoeg om niet te gaan werken maandag
[19:37] <hitest> alienBOB: very nice
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[19:37] <alienBOB> Effe kijken
[19:37] <goarilla> but thats all the dutch for today
[19:37] <alienBOB> YESSSSS... the streets are covered again in white
[19:38] <goarilla> but not enough alienBOB
[19:38] <goarilla> NOT ENOUGH
[19:38] <TheGroove> Het is nog geen maandag.
[19:38] <goarilla> but it's so close
[19:39] <sitwon> 60mbit down is amazing, but 6mbit up seems a little low
[19:39] <sitwon> comparatively
[19:39] <goarilla> i don't like assymetrical
[19:39] <sitwon> I'm sure that's faster than most in the US
[19:39] <goarilla> when you cant get your ACK's out to the sender
[19:39] <goarilla> you'll never reach your download limit
[19:40] <sitwon> goarilla: that doesn't make sense... are you sure you understand TCP/IP?
[19:40] <sitwon> you don't need symmeteric up/down to max out the download
[19:40] <fire|bird> sitwon: Where I'm at in the US, the ISP just upped the speed to 12 down, I can't recall what up was, but speedtest.net reported it at 0.92 up.
[19:41] <sitwon> because the ACKs are tiny and sparse in comparison the the packets you're downloading
[19:41] <goarilla> not that tiny
[19:41] <goarilla> ipv4 is still 40 bytes header
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[19:41] <goarilla> and MTU is 1500 bytes
[19:41] <goarilla> usually
[19:42] <sitwon> fire|bird: I live just outside DC and I have 30M/5M
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[19:42] <macman_> hey all
[19:42] <macman_> why can't i find the slackware 13 gnome iso
[19:42] <goarilla> Oh no you agian
[19:42] <macman_> lol
[19:42] <hitest> macman_ there isn't one
[19:42] <macman_> goarilla, at least im trying slack right
[19:42] <goarilla> gnome is dropped ... for good reasons and a long time ago
[19:42] <macman_> hmm
[19:42] <macman_> and kde is liked for its bloat ?
[19:43] <goarilla> there is gsb or dropline gnome if you do want gnome on slack
[19:43] <sitwon> macman_: there are 3rd-party packages for GNOME
[19:43] <macman_> kde is to bloated
[19:43] <Urchlay> gnome and kde are both bloated, so don't compare them on that basis
[19:43] <sitwon> macman_: I don't use either. Fluxbox, wmii, or awesome.
[19:43] <fire|bird> sitwon: I can't double check right now, my isp's site is down, but iirc the max available here is 40 down.
[19:43] <macman_> what is a recommended iso
[19:43] <macman_> i have like 6 here
[19:44] <macman_> probably that torrent one
[19:44] <macman_> wow 3.7gigs
[19:44] <macman_> wow nice seeds :P goarilla  you seeding it "D
[19:45] <sitwon> fire|bird: fastest I have available is 50M/20M
[19:45] <sitwon> http://www22.verizon.com/Residential/FiOSInternet/Plans/Plans.htm?LOBCode=C&PromoTCode=A0728&PromoSrcCode=B&POEId=BN1SP&CMP=DMC-A0728
[19:45] <hitest> macman_, use the DVD and opt for a full install. you'll like xfce
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[19:46] <macman_> down 547.7KB/s that good ?
[19:46] <fire|bird> sitwon: yikes, I was way off, max down here is 20
[19:47] <goarilla> lol sitwon for once we agree
[19:47] <goarilla> i use awesome now, and fluxbox for over 4 years
[19:47] <sitwon> goarilla: if you like tiled window managers you should checkout Uzbl
[19:48] <goarilla> i don't like them per se
[19:48] <goarilla> it's just that on big screens
[19:48] <goarilla> there is nothing better
[19:49] <sitwon> fire|bird: Verizon claims they will wire the whole country with fiber eventually. I was just lucky to be in one of the first neighborhoods
[19:49] <mac-> Camarade_Tux: SpeedStep now works fine, I`ve loaded module speedstep-smi which enables cpufreq under sys/ then compile and run powernowd which provide support to handle automatic speed changes when necessary
[19:49] <mac-> :)
[19:50] <mac-> but got another problem, more about hardware
[19:51] <mac-> on my IBM ThinkPad T21 can work on battries without any problems, when plugin for power supply after while all hangs and need to make cold reboot ...
[19:51] <mac-> anyone got idea ? maybe someone had similar problem ?
[19:51] <CcSsNET> 6mb up is extreamly high in america
[19:52] <CcSsNET> for residents
[19:52] <macman_> yea but i want to try this now
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[19:53] <goarilla> lol you americans use the word koffers
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[19:55] <metrofox> hi there
[19:55] <sitwon> mac-: I used to run Slackware on a T21 but I never had problems like that
[19:55] <fire|bird> hi metrofox
[19:56] <hitest> hello metrofox
[19:56] <mac-> sitwon: :/
[19:56] <metrofox> hey fire|bird && hitest
[19:56] <hitest> :)
[19:57] <sitwon> mac-: http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:T21
[19:57] <sitwon> might have some useful info
[19:57] <mac-> thx
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[20:15] <acidchild> http://noobfarm.org/viewquote.php?id=1820
[20:15] <acidchild> haha.
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[20:51] <metrofox> see ya
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[20:54] <antiwire> http://www.cavemancircus.com/wp-content/uploads/images/2009/november/brokeback_mountain_2.jpg
[20:55] <goarilla> antiwire
[20:56] <goarilla> i'm praying that's real
[20:56] <antiwire> Don't taze me bro.
[20:56] <goarilla> one always prayes for miracles
[20:56] <goarilla> altho brittany murphy is dead
[20:56] <goarilla> but what about eva mendez :D
[20:57] <goarilla> as replacement
[21:07] <askhader> When sneding an e-mail with mutt, if I change the <from> field, mutt just hangs. Any ideas why? =P
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[21:13] Nick change: antiwire -> NoobieDoobieDoo
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[21:40] <nyRednek> anyone here running slackintosh?
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[21:43] Action: Sigmavirus24 shrugs
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[21:43] <kapu> file1 and file2 have equal number of lines. for line n in file1, append line n in file2 preceded with a tab
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[21:44] <kapu> sed? awk? something else?
[21:44] <Sigmavirus24> kapu: who're you talking to?
[21:44] <kapu> anyone who has enough experience in nix to direct me to the apropriate tool
[21:45] <Pig_Pen> patch
[21:45] <kapu> ty
[21:46] <Pig_Pen> or cat
[21:46] <Pig_Pen> naw, not cat
[21:46] <kapu> thnx again
[21:46] <Sigmavirus24> kapu: you can also use vimdiff
[21:46] <Sigmavirus24> if you like VIm
[21:46] <kapu> it is what i use
[21:46] <kapu> vi vim
[21:47] Action: Sigmavirus24 nods
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[21:47] <Sigmavirus24> and there's git
[21:47] <Sigmavirus24> lol
[21:47] <Sigmavirus24> i'm not as familiar with that
[21:47] <Pig_Pen> vimtutor in lesson 6.4 shows how to copy & paste
[21:47] <Sigmavirus24> yank and put
[21:47] <spook> goarilla
[21:48] <|Slacker|> why gtk apps show crappy fonts under kde 4?
[21:48] <kapu> 5000 lines, need to automate
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[21:48] <Sigmavirus24> idk what you mean |Slacker|
[21:48] <Sigmavirus24> :P
[21:48] <Pig_Pen> yowza! 5000 lines, you got your work cut out for you
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[21:48] <kapu> lol, if I use copy and paste
[21:49] <kapu> I'm still a bit of a noob
[21:49] <|Slacker|> xchat and pidgin just have gigantic fonts in kde4 and I'm unable to change their size using the setting manager
[21:49] <Sigmavirus24> bash script?
[21:49] <NoobieDoobieDoo> I use pidgin and the fonts are perfectly fine
[21:49] <Sigmavirus24> |Slacker|: don't use XChat, use Irssi or bitchx
[21:49] <Sigmavirus24> and don't use Pidgin, use finch
[21:49] <NoobieDoobieDoo> ....
[21:49] <Sigmavirus24> irssi is godly (i'm using it now0
[21:49] <kapu> Sigmavirus24: I'll read up on vimdiff and maybe sed, awk
[21:49] <nyRednek> Sigmavirus24: forget finch, centerim FTW
[21:50] <NoobieDoobieDoo> Sigmavirus24: He is using pidgin.
[21:50] <|Slacker|> okies
[21:50] <Sigmavirus24> and finch's only let down is hat you can't install OTR
[21:50] <Sigmavirus24> kapu: I like vimdiff but I've never edited anything that large
[21:50] <Sigmavirus24> I can ask my brother Jarcorefile if he knows anything better (although i guarantee he'll say git)
[21:51] <kapu> Sigmavirus24: sure
[21:51] <NoobieDoobieDoo> |Slacker|: The fonts work fine in pidgin. Have you even tried changing the font pidgin uses yet?
[21:51] <Pig_Pen> i am thinking maybe a shell script to use patch and/or some regex kind of tool
[21:51] <Sigmavirus24> nyRednek: I've never heard of centerim
[21:51] <nyRednek> Sigmavirus24: i maintain the slackbuild on SBo
[21:51] <|Slacker|> Sigmavirus24, and do ya know where I can get good hints on how to use irssi? like setting automatic stuff like auto connect and auto join?
[21:51] <kapu> Pig_Pen: yeah, me too
[21:51] <Sigmavirus24> irssi.org
[21:51] <|Slacker|> thanks
[21:52] <Sigmavirus24> he links to other guides as well
[21:52] <Sigmavirus24> and I guess you use Konsole |Slacker| ? or do you use xterm?
[21:52] <|Slacker|> konsole
[21:52] <NoobieDoobieDoo> Awesome. Now that you've suggested a completely different program for him to use he will stop troubleshooting a possibly real font issue. Good work.
[21:52] <|Slacker|> I'm all KDE :)
[21:52] <Sigmavirus24> so konsole
[21:52] <Sigmavirus24> woops didn't see that
[21:53] <Sigmavirus24> yeah i prefer konsole for finch and irssi
[21:53] <TheGroove> |Slacker|: http://slackbuilds.org/repository/13.0/libraries/gtk-qt-engine/
[21:53] <TheGroove> THat'll give you a new tab in the KDE control center that allows you to set fonts for non-KDE apps, and it can apply your KDE theme/fonts to non-KDE apps.
[21:54] <|Slacker|> oh thank you
[21:54] <Sigmavirus24> nic TheGroove
[21:54] <Sigmavirus24> *nice
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[21:55] <spook> http://urmom.selfishman.net/redacted_ignore.txt
[21:55] <spook> Irssi::signal_add_first("message public", "do_urmom_in_public") ;
[21:56] <spook> hahahahahaha
[21:56] <Sigmavirus24> lol
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[22:07] <slackwarebob> Hello People.
[22:09] <Sigmavirus24> hello slackwarebob
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[22:17] <slackwarebob> finally no wifi problems with the lid today.
[22:17] <slackwarebob> rather with walking out of range.
[22:20] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, don't get me started on wifi
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[22:21] <NoobieDoobieDoo> oh you guys
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[22:21] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: :). when walking out of range, then going to another router, /etc/rc.d/rc.inet1 restart hoses the whole system.
[22:22] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: so I just did /etc/rc.d/rc.inet1 stop before leavning. The only way to not hose it, possibly.
[22:22] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, even worse, my wireless card doesn't work on slackware
[22:22] <NoobieDoobieDoo> My system roams flawlessly
[22:22] <LnxSlck> wierd
[22:22] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: now configuring pm-utils to disconnect wifi on suspend and such and to reconnect rc.inet1 on connect.
[22:23] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, nice
[22:23] <Sigmavirus24> Under 12.1 my wireless card was shit since it was a new laptop
[22:23] <Sigmavirus24> 12.2 didn't fix it
[22:23] <Sigmavirus24> thank god for 13
[22:23] <NoobieDoobieDoo> slackwarebob: I did not need to take any special steps for my system to behave the way you describe. wpa_supplicant works
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[22:23] <slackwarebob> NoobieDoobieDoo: my did too when I was using kubuntu. But on slackware, the rc.inet1 restart command hangs.
[22:23] <LnxSlck> Sigmavirus24, mine works, but then it stops working
[22:23] <LnxSlck> crappy atheros card
[22:23] Nick change: NoobieDoobieDoo -> antiwire
[22:23] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: atheros has pretty good support on linux.
[22:24] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, not this card
[22:24] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, it works like a charm in windows
[22:24] <antiwire> LnxSlck: dude come on
[22:24] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, but in slackware, not with kernel drivers, not with madwifi, not with ndiswrapper
[22:24] <antiwire> that's not a consistent comparison
[22:24] <LnxSlck> antiwire, just to say that it just doesn't work on linux
[22:25] <antiwire> Ok, in that sense the comparison is simply verifying that the hardware works so that is valid.
[22:25] <LnxSlck> antiwire, yes, just to say that the hardware is working fine
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[22:27] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: that sucks. I remember buying a $10 card usb that worked in windows/linux just great.
[22:27] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, this crappy card, fails to work, last chance is to compile a new kernel.
[22:28] <slackwarebob> anybody know how to set the default entry in lilo? Just the first is default?
[22:28] <antiwire> default = label_here
[22:28] <slackwarebob> LnxSlck: hmmm, that's one thing on gentoo. the kernel sources are already setup to compile over and over. :)
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[22:28] <slackwarebob> antiwire: thanks.
[22:28] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, nice
[22:28] <antiwire> slackwarebob: the kernel sources are packaged and installed with a slackware full install as well...
[22:29] <mancha> we need a new "i close the lid and $something breaks" story
[22:29] <slackwarebob> antiwire: I mean that all the initial compilation is done. So recompiling is faster.
[22:29] <slackwarebob> mancha: no, I manually ran /etc/rc.d/rc.inet1 stop, before leaving so I don't have to reboot.
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[22:30] <antiwire> slackwarebob: are you using wpa_supplicant?
[22:30] <slackwarebob> it wasn't so much lid related as it was dropping connection related.
[22:31] <slackwarebob> antiwire: yeah using wpa_supplicant configured in rc.inet1.conf.
[22:31] <antiwire> which wireless card and driver?
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[22:31] <mancha> if you have no new ones maybe you can make some up? close lid -> kde background color turns purple or summit
[22:32] <yeti> hello, I need help in connecting to my remote Windows 7 hard drive (shared with music)... and also sound.
[22:32] <yeti> i currently use GNOME but i am installing KDE
[22:32] <mancha> is the win7 drive being "shared"?
[22:33] <yeti> mancha, yes.. with a user name and password
[22:33] <antiwire> mount -t cifs -o username=blah //IP_HERE/share_name_here /mount/point/here
[22:33] <slackwarebob> mancha: to be honest with you, I really appreciated your help, and so your condescension is not going to make me be rude to you.
[22:33] <antiwire> as if mancha cares
[22:33] <slackwarebob> he has been trying desperately.
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[22:34] <yeti> antiwire, err... do I have to do this everytime i log in or logout or shutdown/restart (this is a laptop)?
[22:34] <antiwire> he's acting normal though
[22:34] <antiwire> yeti: there are a few ways to automate this
[22:34] <antiwire> you can use fstab
[22:34] <crashdata> hi, i'm having trouble accesing my samba share on my linux box.... its asking for username and password eventhough its set as public...but even using the proper credential (root account)  still wont let me access it...
[22:35] <yeti> ok.. so create a mount point in /etc/fstab then mount it.
[22:35] <antiwire> crashdata: are you using share or user level security?
[22:36] <antiwire> if you are using user level security you are screwed.
[22:36] <antiwire> you need to use share level security if you want to allow no username/passwords
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[22:37] <crashdata> security = user
[22:37] <antiwire> I've been down this road.
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[22:37] <antiwire> start reading about the differences between samba user security and share security settings.
[22:37] <slackwarebob> oh the joys of configuring samba to not prompt for credentials.
[22:38] <antiwire> If you change to share level security you can get the behavior you seek but you loose functionality
[22:38] <crashdata> but howcome, even using the proper credential to login its still wont let me in?
[22:38] <mancha> is everyone pretty much using cifs these days? ie smb sleeps with the fishes?
[22:38] <antiwire> crashdata: do you have a samba user created?
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[22:38] <crashdata> antiwire, that answers it :)
[22:38] <antiwire> crashdata: you need to use smbpasswd to create a samba user that matches a system user account
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[22:39] <antiwire> ie: linux user1 has a matching smbpasswd entry and for ease of use, use the same password
[22:39] <crashdata> i thought i can use the same account that i have set up in my system
[22:39] <antiwire> with PAM you can
[22:40] <antiwire> In our case, you must use smbpasswd to create samba users
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[22:40] <slackwarebob> Hello People.
[22:40] <slackwarebob> oh the joys of running kde. random crashes are part of the experience.
[22:40] <crashdata> antiwire, i just use share as security for now :)
[22:40] <crashdata> what sort of functionality will be loss if i use share?
[22:41] <mancha> hrmm, s-bob,you might consider tweaking your kde, not running a bleeding edge version, or my personal favorite: not running it at all
[22:41] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, mine never crashed
[22:41] <slackwarebob> I clicked on a link in konsole, which launches konq, but then said kmserver failed, then crashed X.
[22:42] <hoobop> slackwarebob, are you running 13 and kde4?
[22:42] <mancha> if you can tie that into a lid closing you'll make my day!
[22:42] <slackwarebob> mancha: hehe, I like the eye candy of kde tho. So I'm ok with the occassional crash.
[22:43] <slackwarebob> hoobop: 13/kde4.
[22:43] <hoobop> thanks; collecting data; still not sure about making the switch
[22:43] <LnxSlck> slackwarebob, i run current/kde4
[22:43] <mancha> well, if you're a candy addict, what can i say, godspeed young padawan
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[22:43] <Pig_Pen> ah ha! i found a new geeky lightweight window manager vtwm (twm with multiple desktops) tweakable with .vtwmrc http://www.vtwm.org/
[22:45] <mancha> isn't that what fvwm is basically?  (twm with multiple virt desktops(
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[22:45] <Pig_Pen> not exactly, similar
[22:46] <slackwarebob> I have finally narrowed it down to flux/dwm/kde.
[22:46] <slackwarebob> started looking at wmii a little but, nah....
[22:47] <Pig_Pen> now that you mention it though, i see vtwm has the same annoying bug as fvwm does in slack 13, open firefox and from the "File" menu select to open or save dialog, it is half off the screen to the south east
[22:47] <hoobop> that's quite the bug
[22:47] <hoobop> can you "fix" its location?
[22:47] <Pig_Pen> so far openbox or dwm is the only thing i can really be comfortable with on 13
[22:48] <hoobop> fix/set etc?
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[22:48] <slackwarebob> lol, firefox inadequacies can hardly be blamed on your wm/de.
[22:48] <Pig_Pen> i can move it on to the center of the screen but the next time i use it, back to the south east (bottom right) off the screen by 30 to 50 percent
[22:48] <hoobop> hmmm...
[22:49] <slackwarebob> I like dwm for playing media on teh side and using mainspace for work.
[22:49] <Pig_Pen> lets try some other gtk based apps
[22:49] <Pig_Pen> gimp is ok
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[22:52] <Pig_Pen> i will look through firefox's localstore.rdf and try to fix it
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[22:54] <Pig_Pen> nope, not in there
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[22:55] <Pig_Pen> well, its late, i am sleepy so off to dreamland for me, laters
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[22:59] <|Slacker|> hey ppl I remember slackbuilds used to have an automatic builder, where can I get it?
[23:03] <antiwire> Are you talking about sbopkg?
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[23:05] <|Slacker|> yep
[23:05] <fire|bird> sbopkg.org
[23:05] <|Slacker|> thanks a million
[23:06] <antiwire> you can paypal me that million
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[23:07] <fire|bird> complete silence, he must be logging in to PayPal.
[23:08] <LnxSlck> hy fire|bird
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[23:09] Nick change: NaCl -> SpanishInquisitr
[23:10] <fire|bird> hey LnxSlck, how's it going?
[23:10] <LnxSlck> fire|bird, nice.. trying to get this stupid wifi card to work
[23:10] <antiwire> we've got some freaking santa ana winds again
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[23:10] Action: SpanishInquisitr waves hello to fire|bird 
[23:11] <fire|bird> \o SpanishInquisitr
[23:11] <antiwire> it's going to be stupid windy tonight
[23:11] <SpanishInquisitr> antiwire: It's been blowy here all day
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[23:11] <antiwire> I'm going to walk down to the pier and check it out
[23:15] Nick change: SpanishInquisitr -> NaCl
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[23:32] <ShazbotMcNasty> I've got a new 64 bit computer, but i've already got the 32 bit ISo downloaded, should I take the trouble of downloading the 64 bit? Or does it not make much of a difference?
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[23:51] <crashdata> antiwire, i ended using security =  user seems to be more secure :0
[23:51] <spook> ShazbotMcNasty: you'll see about 30ish% better preformance
[23:51] <ShazbotMcNasty> ah, that seems worth it then
[23:51] <ShazbotMcNasty> It's downloading...
[23:51] <ShazbotMcNasty> slowly but surely
[23:51] <spook> YMMV
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[23:52] <ShazbotMcNasty> 'tiss a big'n
[23:52] <ShazbotMcNasty> my first install of slackware
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[23:52] <slackwarebob> Hello People.
[23:52] <crashdata> hello slack
[23:52] <ShazbotMcNasty> Not sure what window manager or anything I should use yet.
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[23:52] <ShazbotMcNasty> I was thinking about using awesome
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[23:52] <spook> ShazbotMcNasty: if you dont know, then try as many as you can.
[23:53] <Xeliaa> anyone know of a repository thats got more updated mono packages? like 2.6.2
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[23:53] <crashdata> ShazbotMcNasty, comes with kde..i like it :) u might want to install slack current for the new version of kde
[23:53] <spook> Xeliaa: what?
[23:53] <spook> Xeliaa: all the mirrors have the same data...
[23:53] <Xeliaa> err 2.6.1 even
[23:53] <Xeliaa> no they dont
[23:53] <Xeliaa> there's many other package projects out there.
[23:54] <Xeliaa> like linuxpackages, slacky, Vislabs
[23:54] <spook> oh you mean 3rd party
[23:54] <ShazbotMcNasty> Is there anything I should know for my first install of slackware?
[23:54] <spook> hahaha linuxpackages.   never use linuxpackages.
[23:54] <Xeliaa> it has a few things sometimes.
[23:54] <NaCl> ShazbotMcNasty: man pages are your friends
[23:54] <ShazbotMcNasty> Also - first build install, I've only used newb distros before this.
[23:54] <ShazbotMcNasty> yeah, lol
[23:54] <spook> ShazbotMcNasty: read the slackbook.org
[23:56] <NaCl> ShazbotMcNasty: it details pretty much everything
[23:56] <ShazbotMcNasty> looking at it now.
[23:57] <crashdata> for x64 to install or compile using slackbuild u have to do ARCH=x86_64 ./file.slackbuild
[23:57] <spook> crashdata: or export ARCH=x86_64 or set it in your bash profile or... etc etc
[23:57] <crashdata> yup yup
[23:58] <ShazbotMcNasty> I can install slackware with a usb stick right?
[23:58] <spook> yup
[23:58] <Xeliaa> ya
[23:58] <ShazbotMcNasty> okay cool...
[23:58] <Xeliaa> try Unetbootin
[23:58] <ShazbotMcNasty> yeah, that's what I usually use, i just wanted to make sure don't need an .img or something...
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[23:59] <Xeliaa> i need to test if it can make a USB boot disk for Leopard OSX
[23:59] <crashdata> for x64 slack i cant get farsight2 to work on amsn though
[23:59] <Xeliaa> cos a friend of mine keeps darn bugging me about it.
[23:59] <ShazbotMcNasty> I just remember when I tried to install it in vmware, it asked for a second disk...
[23:59] <ShazbotMcNasty> and I didn't know what to do, considering I just used the whole iso
[23:59] <Xeliaa> for linux pack dont need to install it.
[00:00] --- Sun Jan  3 2010