[00:00] <dive> I tried slim some time ago, but had some problems with it
[00:00] <raela> synyster: big bulky thing, ugh :P
[00:00] <dive> I think it wouldn't restart after logging out
[00:02] <slackmagic> dive: yeah, you want to read the README.SLACKWARE for this that's included in the SBo. That'll keep starting up slim when you log out
[00:03] <dive> right
[00:03] <dive> kdm is good enough for me now though. I rarely use it anyway - tend to hibernate laptop.
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[00:39] <Buntfu> anyone in here ever sell any linux hardware or systems?
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[00:43] <byteframe> Buntfu, yeah.
[00:43] <byteframe> I like to rip off the windows stickers and install Linucks on computers I pawn off on ebay, should that count.
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[00:44] <Buntfu> byteframe, lol i hear ya i've done that a ton
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[00:57] <nyRednek> byteframe: you know, there is a slackware sticker that fits in place of the windows sticker
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[01:01] <byteframe> nyRednek, Cool beans.
[01:02] Nick change: rainyrhy2 -> rainyrhy
[01:03] <nyRednek> byteframe: it's on cafepress somewhere
[01:05] <alisonken1home> there's also http://store.slackware.com/cgi-bin/store/slackplate?id=8qoHYRYN&mv_pc=96
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[01:07] <byteframe> Also, there's: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/slackware
[01:08] <alisonken1home> that looks like an online game forum
[01:08] <byteframe> Same logo though, I like the blue S.
[01:09] Action: Motoko-chan should join that.
[01:09] <byteframe> Only if you play via wine :)
[01:09] <alisonken1home> thought we were looking for slackware stickers to cover the windows sticker :)
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[01:10] <byteframe> I must admit, I just give the recipients of my ebays, ubuntu...
[01:11] <alisonken1home> I think someone at cafepress needs to redo their pictures - they have the same picture for the Slackware Gnome and Slackware KDE mousepads
[01:11] <Orlov> hello, what the best way to get slackware 64 to work with multi libs?
[01:11] <Motoko-chan> byteframe, I usually reboot as Portal doesn't work well in Wine.
[01:12] <alisonken1home> nm - same picture except for the button on the right has either KDE or Gnome
[01:12] <byteframe> Motoko-chan, have you tried dxlevel 81?
[01:12] <Motoko-chan> Nope.
[01:12] <alisonken1home> Orlov: install alien
[01:12] <alisonken1home> s multilib pakcages
[01:12] <Motoko-chan> Haven't done much trial.
[01:12] <Motoko-chan> I do run multiple production Slackware servers, though.
[01:13] <alisonken1home> good one - "Geek Since Birth, LInux User" classic thong - made in the USA
[01:13] <Orlov> alisonken1home: aliens?
[01:14] <alisonken1home> Orlov: http://connie.slackware.com/~alien/multilib/
[01:14] <Orlov> ah. ta
[01:14] <trhodes> hey Orlov
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[01:14] Action: Orlov goes to read this
[01:14] <Orlov> sup trhodes
[01:15] <trhodes> not much, i see you're trying out multilib - good luck with that
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[01:19] Action: byteframe is still scared of 64 bits.
[01:21] <jeev> ken, city of bell "manager" makes 800k/year with 12% annual raise, assistant, 376k, police chief, 475!
[01:21] <trhodes> jeev, lots of city managers are like that
[01:21] <raela> byteframe: yeah I don't use it on my personal laptop
[01:22] <jeev> this one makes 2x more than most
[01:22] <alisonken1home> is that bell, ca, usa?
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[01:27] <Orlov> alisonken1home/trhodes: hmm this should be doable after rereading acouple of times
[01:27] <alisonken1home> it's not hard. I just switched back to 21-bit though, because I don't do massive number crunching and I don't have >4G ram
[01:28] <alisonken1home> something about the wife and skype, hulu+flash :)
[01:28] <trhodes> haha, *32, alisonken1home :)
[01:28] <alisonken1home> s/21/32/ :)
[01:29] <nyRednek> interesting, have about three sores on my feet that refuse to heal
[01:29] <nyRednek> they're just getting deeper
[01:29] <mdeanda> heh.
[01:30] <nyRednek> i can see muscle tissue through one
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[01:53] <Buntfu> any system builders in here?
[01:54] <alisonken1home> what's your definition of "system builder"?
[01:54] <alisonken1home> hardware, software, ..etc. ..?
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[01:57] <Buntfu> hardware mostly
[01:57] <BP{k}> I've build a few systems.
[01:57] <alisonken1home> what did you want to know?
[01:57] <terry> I'm wanting to create just a 2CD install set, so;  Am I correct in assuming that if I just leave out kdei I'll still have a working (English only) KDE system?
[01:58] <terry> Or do I need to leave out more?
[01:58] <alisonken1home> kdei and sources - plus a few others - might get you down to 2 cd's
[01:58] <terry> .. in order to fit onto 2 CDs...
[01:58] <BP{k}> you can leave out emacs ;)
[01:58] <Buntfu> build any and sold them?
[01:59] <alisonken1home> definitely leave out emacs :)
[01:59] <BP{k}> Buntfu: no. although I have build systems for friends/family members
[01:59] <terry> alisonken1home: Leaving out all the sources.
[01:59] <alisonken1home> long time ago, ues
[01:59] <alisonken1home> Buntfu: long time ago - yes
[01:59] <Buntfu> BP{k}, ahhh yea i do that alot also
[01:59] <terry> I have the DVD
[01:59] <Buntfu> alisonken1home, cool i still find myself doing it quite a bit
[02:00] <Buntfu> i'm just trying to find some builders or sellers of linux systems
[02:01] <Buntfu> i not sure why more people don't like doing it lol but i love to save a machine with linux
[02:02] <alisonken1home> for a lot of people, it's because they want the latest and greatest MS
[02:02] <Buntfu> true i guess but for god knows why
[02:02] <Buntfu> i find it funny that many people that i've set up linux for get everything done they need and really don't care what it is
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[02:04] <MLanden> Buntfu: not willing to learn? some're like that..with the learning curve,that is
[02:04] <Buntfu> MLanden, i suppose
[02:04] <Buntfu> lol
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[02:04] <alisonken1home> company policy - clueless techs or lock-in to a specific program
[02:05] <Buntfu> i think a lot of it is the refusal to allow their education to be of less importance
[02:06] <Buntfu> in otherwords trained for microsoft stay on microsoft at all cost
[02:09] <Buntfu> anyway i just wanted to give the hardware / system builders here a heads up about a site i've been building for quite a long time now... so I was looking for some interested peeps
[02:10] <byteframe> Does headsup == URL?
[02:10] <Buntfu> byteframe, http://www.buntfu.com
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[02:18] <Buntfu> so i'm just looking for some hardware peeps
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[02:24] <kornerr> hi
[02:25] <kornerr> does slackpkg have any dependency list?
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[02:28] <alisonken1home> dependencies should be listed in the readme for the slackbuild
[02:28] <BP{k}> kornerr: no.
[02:29] <kornerr> I need to update from 13.0 to 13.1 and thus have 2 possibilities: DVD or slackpkg/slapt-get
[02:29] <BP{k}> slackkg + docs
[02:29] <kornerr> with upgrade I fear I will leave custom packages old
[02:29] <kornerr> what's the best tool to upgrade custom packages?
[02:30] <BP{k}> upgradepkg(8)
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[02:31] <kornerr> well, I need to find out which packages are mine
[02:31] <kornerr> first
[02:31] <kornerr> is there a way?
[02:32] <BP{k}> well packages from SBo/rworkman/alien will have a tag.
[02:32] <kornerr> yeah. right.
[02:33] <kornerr> wow. 60 of SBo.
[02:33] <trhodes> also, the slackware packages have a PACKAGE LOCATION line
[02:34] <BP{k}> ll well there is a way .. but  .
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[02:35] <trhodes> that package location will have the package series if it's from slackware proper
[02:35] <BP{k}> basically run slackpkg clean-system, which will generate a list of what is not part of slackware. Then just ^C ouf slackpkg. don't under any circumstances press okay or it will remove stuff.
[02:36] <trhodes> ah ok, what BP{k} said is pretty easy :)
[02:36] <trhodes> I seperate own by date since I do full installs
[02:36] <trhodes> *my own
[02:36] <kornerr> ok. I get a list. but I will need to rebuild it
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[02:37] <kornerr> and is there some sort of atomation?
[02:37] <kornerr> automation
[02:37] <kornerr> I guess exactly for building
[02:37] <BP{k}> kornerr: You may want to look at sbopkg.
[02:38] <kornerr> thanks
[02:38] <kornerr> can I append custom repo to it?
[02:38] <alisonken1home> append - no
[02:39] <alisonken1home> sbopkg looks at slackbuilds.org - hence sbopkg
[02:39] <kornerr> one or two SBos I built aren't present at slackbuilds.org
[02:39] <BP{k}> which ones?
[02:40] <kornerr> ALURE one of them
[02:40] <kornerr> for OpenAL
[02:40] <BP{k}> alure was never part of sbo by the looks of it.
[02:40] <kornerr> yep
[02:40] <kornerr> so it should be added, but there's no recent tarball release, only git version
[02:41] <kornerr> so that's why I would like my own repo
[02:42] <BP{k}> kornerr: well for a few building them by hand isn't going to hurt that much.
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[02:42] <kornerr> :)
[02:42] <BP{k}> I keep a small dir on my system with builds that haven't been submitted to sbo
[02:42] <kornerr> oh
[02:42] <kornerr> ok
[02:43] <kornerr> also, I've installed Ubuntu afterwards and now have GRUB instead of LILO. slackpkg upgrade won't erase it, right?
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[02:44] <alisonken1home> unless lilo get's updated, no it shouldn't
[02:44] <BP{k}> it probably will ask you if you want to run lilo. just tell it no.
[02:44] <BP{k}> alisonken1home: "unless the kernel" :)
[02:45] <alisonken1home> heh
[02:45] <alisonken1home> that too :)
[02:45] Action: kornerr has just found out about queue files
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[02:45] <kornerr> I guess I can make some queue file to build all custom packages?
[02:46] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest92650
[02:46] <MLanden> couldn't lilo be placed in the blacklist...since he's using grub(just as a precaution) ?
[02:47] <BP{k}> yes
[02:47] <BP{k}> but really, instaling lilo don't do no harm.
[02:48] <kornerr> ok. slackpkg seems fine, but this time I want to install GSB gnome too, so I'll end up having slapt-get too. is it ok?
[02:48] <MLanden> true...thanks, BP{k}
[02:48] <BP{k}> kornerr: while I believe slapt-get has much improved over the years , I can't comment on how well it works.
[02:49] <BP{k}> personally I would use slackpkg for upgrading your system and slapt-get for GSB but that is me.
[02:49] <BP{k}> I am sort CDOP about things like that.
[02:49] <alisonken1home> CDOP huh?
[02:49] <BP{k}> yeps ;)
[02:49] <kornerr> what is CDOP?
[02:50] <alisonken1home> I don't think it's the Catholic Diocese of Peoria
[02:50] <kornerr> yeah
[02:50] <BP{k}> kornerr: it's like OCPD (obsessive compulsive personality disorder) but then with the letters in alphabetical order.
[02:50] <Motoko-chan> Never know...
[02:50] <kornerr> lol
[02:51] <kornerr> it's like ENOP EORSSU software
[02:52] <BP{k}> fail
[02:52] <BP{k}> you mean "CEORSSU" of course ;)
[02:52] <kornerr> ah geez. yes
[02:52] <kornerr> ceorsu
[02:52] <kornerr> source
[02:53] <kornerr> reminds me of ABBA
[02:54] <BP{k}> anyway, I am out .. later folks :)
[02:54] <kornerr> c you
[02:54] <alisonken1home> have a good one BP{k}
[02:56] <trhodes> later, BP{k}
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[03:10] <kornerr> will slackpkg put info into /var/log/packages?
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[03:13] <jeev> yes
[03:13] <jeev> kornerr, ls /var/log/packages/*SBo*
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[03:14] <kornerr> it's sbopkg
[03:14] <kornerr> then
[03:17] <jeev> ?
[03:17] <jeev> oh sorry haha
[03:18] <alisonken1home> kornerr: sbopkg and slackpkg both use installpkg to install your packages, so all packages installed will get an entry in /var/log/packages
[03:18] <kornerr> oh
[03:18] <kornerr> ok
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[03:20] <kornerr> jeez. sometimes I think clean re-install will be easier
[03:20] <kornerr> less to read
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[04:11] <Zordrak> Morn
[04:14] <MLanden> heya, Zordrak
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[04:24] <fatalnix> wow is the sun coming up already? damn
[04:24] <fatalnix> ...
[04:26] <MLanden> fatalnix: might be http://static.die.net/earth/mercator/1600.jpg ..;)
[04:27] <fatalnix> still has a few thousand miles to go :)
[04:27] <fatalnix> but at ~ a thousand miles an hour that isnt hard
[04:27] <fatalnix> hmm
[04:29] <fatalnix> you can go back in time with a concord.
[04:29] <fatalnix> concorde*
[04:29] <fatalnix> :)
[04:29] <trhodes> nice artwork in that pic
[04:30] <trhodes> hmm, i guess it's actually satellite imagery
[04:30] <MLanden> static.die.net is a good site..linux man...that pic of the earth...moon phase
[04:31] <MLanden> actually die.net*
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[04:35] <Zordrak> hmmm.. iteresting/concerning.. shutting down my desktop to do an offline backup.. and its hung at Unmounting local filesystems.. no detail
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[04:36] <MLanden> Zordrak: stale node?
[04:36] <Zordrak> not sure..
[04:36] <Zordrak> im wonderingf if i have a loop mount still going on an nfs share that is being treated as local because its loop
[04:37] <Zordrak> theres is an NFS share marked as busy/rmounted ro
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[04:38] <MLanden> Zordrak: still active?
[04:38] <Zordrak> not sure whats best to do with it.. not sure i have any options except reisub
[04:38] <Zordrak> MLanden: clarify..
[04:39] <Zordrak> screw it. REISUB
[04:39] <trhodes> might as well
[04:41] <Zordrak> hmm.. now what do i normally boot for this backup... been waaaay to l/ong
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[04:43] <Zordrak> hm.
[04:43] <MLanden> Zordrak: just referring to an inactive nfs port...was thinking of autofs
[04:43] <Zordrak> MLanden: aye.. noautofs on this box, its all fstab
[04:43] <Zordrak> O_o, no luks on slack dvd
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[04:48] Nick change: Guest77998 -> RaNdY
[04:48] <Zordrak> ugh. my bad.
[04:48] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest38325
[04:50] <Zordrak> is there a command to list all dm devices with info?
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[04:53] <trhodes> well, there's pvdisplay, to show physical volumes
[04:53] <Zordrak> aaaaaaaaaarrrgh
[04:54] <Zordrak> -/bin/sh: rsync: not found
[04:54] <Zordrak> c'mon pat, this shit's crucial
[04:55] <trhodes> hmm, dmsetup or lvm are all that's available as a static binary
[04:55] <Zordrak> nm.. listing the devnodes is enough
[04:55] <Zordrak> im now onte trying to install rsync into the install dvd from an nfs mirror
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[05:05] <Zordrak> #
[05:09] <adrien> once, I was in the slackware installer and actually installed everything into memory instead of on a partition =)
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[05:10] <MLanden> adrien: on to a ramdisk?
[05:10] <Zordrak> adrien: i just really wish pat would do an official live version for USB sticks
[05:10] <Zordrak> it would be beyond useful
[05:11] <adrien> MLanden: yup, I actually stopped it before the end but it gave me a pretty good install ;-)
[05:12] <adrien> Zordrak: well, alienBOB wanted to do something, and you can always 'installpkg' in the install cd/dvd/whatever, works well
[05:12] <MLanden> adrien: sweet...could imagine
[05:13] <adrien> what made me realize my mistake was the speed of install, even ghostscript installed in a few seconds instead of a few minutes
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[05:14] (##slackware) Channel ban on *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip* expired.
[05:14] ##slackware: mode change '-b *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip*' by slackboy!~thongsong@li6-30.members.linode.com
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[05:17] <Zordrak> adrien: ive done that for this instance... but it doesnt compare to having slack boot straight from a stick
[05:17] <Zordrak> what/s bob said{
[05:17] <adrien> yeah, of course
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[05:19] <telemarketer> hi all
[05:21] <MLanden> heya
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[05:22] <telemarketer> how is everyone
[05:22] <MLanden> doin' fine,telemarketer....yourself?
[05:23] <telemarketer> okay.........I burned myself a GoblinX live CD yesterday and played with that for a while, very impressive :)
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[05:24] <telemarketer> after about 10 minutes of tweaking it was virtually indistinguishable from my sw 12.2 install :)
[05:24] <telemarketer> and it booted pretty quick, about 50 seconds
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[05:27] <MLanden> been a while since I messed with that distro..had to check out the halloween-link themes...yeah,one of those quick distros, telemarketer
[05:27] <MLanden> s/link/like
[05:28] <telemarketer> there was no halloween stuff on there, but some other pretty cool wallpapers.......v 2.7
[05:28] <telemarketer> then it 'evolved' from goblinX to imagineOS and droppped KDE :(
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[05:29] <telemarketer> my 3 favorite live SW based cd's are zenwalk, vector linux, and slax
[05:30] <fatalnix> gah I always forget the name of that hex editor slackware has
[05:30] <telemarketer> but I have to say I'm most impressed with GoblinX although it didn't have my printer in CUPS
[05:30] <fatalnix> need it to write some programs :)
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[05:31] <telemarketer> oh heck......I was goofing around wiht the hex editor the other week
[05:31] <telemarketer> one of em, forgot the name
[05:31] <MLanden> telemarketer: was referring to the colors used for I think 2.3 or 2.4(been a while)
[05:32] <telemarketer> sooooooooo..........on distros where CUPS doesn't have your printer, is there a repository where you can d/l them ?????
[05:32] <trhodes> fatalnix: fwiw, vim and emacs can do hex editing
[05:32] <telemarketer> I guess maybe cups.org
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[05:33] <fatalnix> oh thats right, vim can, actually I never got vim to do it, just vi.. which was weird. hmm. wonder how you do it in emacs...
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[05:33] <trhodes> hexl-mode
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[05:34] <fatalnix> yeah I foun dit
[05:34] <fatalnix> too bad it's machine native hex editing
[05:34] <telemarketer> ahhhhhhhh..........shed
[05:35] <fatalnix> it confuses the heck out of me lol
[05:35] <telemarketer> try 'shed' (simple hex editor)
[05:35] <trhodes> fatalnix: yeah, it's weird; overwrites by default: http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Editing-Binary-Files.html
[05:35] <telemarketer> brb
[05:35] <fatalnix> hmm
[05:36] <telemarketer> DESCRIPTION
[05:36] <telemarketer>        A simple hex editor with a pico-style interface.
[05:36] <telemarketer>        Each  line  of  the  shed display represents one byte of the file.
[05:37] <fatalnix> ic.
[05:37] <trhodes> fatalnix: do you have kde ?
[05:38] <trhodes> if so, try okteta
[05:38] <MLanden> is khex still maintained?
[05:38] <fatalnix> it doesn't seem bad. and no, I have wmii
[05:38] <fatalnix> and half the time I don't even run C
[05:38] <fatalnix> X*
[05:38] <fatalnix> on my laptop I do
[05:38] <fatalnix> wmii
[05:38] <fatalnix> man I'm tired I'm repeating myself.. ? :D
[05:39] <fatalnix> there is a hex editor Slackware comes with that's bugging me because it's really good, and I forget the name..
[05:39] <trhodes> MLanden: i think khexedit was replaced by okteta
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[05:39] <fatalnix> x something or h something or..
[05:39] <fatalnix> it was a 3 letter name I think
[05:40] <telemarketer> number                                                                                     shed 1.13
[05:40] <telemarketer> offs  asc hex dec oct bin
[05:40] <telemarketer> 0019:     00  000 000 00000000
[05:40] Channel flood from telemarketer -- kicking
[05:40] <telemarketer> 0020:     01  001 001 00000001
[05:40] <telemarketer> 0021:     00  000 000 00000000
[05:40] telemarketer kicked from ##slackware by slackboy: flood
[05:40] <MLanden> trhodes: ok...thanks...didn't think it was ported over from kde3
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[05:41] <telemarketer> oops
[05:41] <telemarketer> sorry about the flood
[05:41] <wobbles> fatalnix:  shed ??
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[05:41] <telemarketer> yes, that was shed output
[05:42] <telemarketer> a small c program I had laying around
[05:42] <telemarketer> part of it
[05:42] <fatalnix> no
[05:42] <fatalnix> I did check out shed, it's alright
[05:42] <telemarketer> I'm trying to remember if jstar worked
[05:43] <telemarketer> brb
[05:44] <trhodes> bpe ?
[05:44] <fatalnix> HEME!
[05:44] <fatalnix> I think
[05:45] <fatalnix> yes it was heme I'm pretty sure
[05:45] <fatalnix> which doesn't appear to come with slackware anymore so I'm going to find it
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[05:46] <fatalnix> sweet :)
[05:46] <fatalnix> now I can write some programs up in machine code
[05:47] <trhodes> glibc's overrated anyway, right ?
[05:47] <trhodes> :P
[05:47] <fatalnix> thanks for the help by the way. I can never remember the name
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[05:49] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest90619
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[05:53] <fatalnix> should probably go to sleep soon it's almost 6 AM :)
[05:54] <zux1wrk> wrong, only only woke up an hour ago
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[06:17] <phrag> morning lads o/
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[06:17] <trhodes> hey phrag
[06:18] <MLanden> morning, phrag
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[06:43] <slava_dp> Hi folks. Do you know if openoffice.org 3.2.1 supports opening and editing password-protected xls files? When I open a password-protected xls file, it opens as read-only, and I cannot modify it.
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[06:48] <MLanden> slava_dp: heard gnumeric MIGHT be able to open some password-protected xls files
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[06:49] Nick change: Guest90619 -> RaNdY
[06:50] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest59454
[06:50] mrcarrot (~lasse@86-60-154-229-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi) joined ##slackware.
[06:53] <mrcarrot> i have many times been wondering why #slackware is forwarding everybody to ##slackware
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[06:54] <mrcarrot> what is the reason behind this strange thing?
[06:54] <MLanden> mrcarrot: http://freenode.net/policy.shtml under channel naming
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[06:56] <Destructo> its been like that since at least 5 years ago.. they do it to keep bots out
[06:56] <slava_dp> MLanden, solved. I was stupid. http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=31997
[06:56] <alienBOB> It has been like that since the inception of official channels
[06:57] <mrcarrot> okay, thanks
[06:57] <MLanden> slava_dp: you and me both....thanks on the info
[06:57] <alienBOB> The # channels for poducts etc are for the owners of that product only. If (like with Slackware) the owner does not want to run his own channel, then an "unofficial" channel will be used (with double #) as a redirect
[06:58] <alienBOB> Desit has nothing to do with keeping bots out
[06:58] <alienBOB> Destructo: it has nothing to do with keeping bots out
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[07:05] <Destructo> oh
[07:07] <zux1wrk> is it possible to run linux software raid (level 10) with 2 drives and add the other 2 later?
[07:09] <mrcarrot> at least it should be possible to run 01
[07:09] <mrcarrot> but i could be wrong
[07:10] <mrcarrot> i am using only raid 0 myself
[07:11] <zux1wrk> raid 10 should be striped over mirror, right?
[07:11] <zux1wrk> hmm or maybe i'll try it differently
[07:12] <zux1wrk> hah, got it
[07:12] <zux1wrk> turns out there is a difference in what order you list the drives
[07:13] <zux1wrk> "/dev/sde3 /dev/sdf3 missing missing" doesn't work, while "/dev/sde3 missing /dev/sdf3 missing" works
[07:13] <mrcarrot> yes.. and 01 is two striped sets that are mirrored
[07:14] <mrcarrot> so i assume you could make one striped set first... and then later add the other
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[07:14] <mrcarrot> and then mirror the first to the second
[07:14] <mrcarrot> as much as i have been playing with linux software raid i can not see any problem with raid 01
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[07:21] <rob0> If only the ## *would* keep bots out!!
[07:21] <rob0> Try adding a few more ##'s?
[07:22] <alienBOB> All hail the ####slackware channel
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[07:23] <MLanden> could imagine the forwarding...#slackware-->##slackware-->almost there-->###slackware--->just one more--->####slackware...tada!!..;)
[07:26] <raela> make a random additional one each week.. if you can find how many #'s, win a prize
[07:26] <mrcarrot> and why would the bots not get forwarded?
[07:27] <mwalling> they do
[07:28] <mrcarrot> yeah, so ## is not protecting anything
[07:28] <mwalling> mrcarrot: [07-16] 06:55:55 < alienBOB> Destructo: it has nothing to do with keeping bots out
[07:28] <mwalling> plz to be reading the backlog.
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[07:28] <mrcarrot> i read it...
[07:28] <alienBOB> You failed to read why there is a difference between # and ## channels -  it has nothing to do with bots
[07:29] <mrcarrot> 14:19 < rob0> If only the ## *would* keep bots out!!
[07:29] <mrcarrot> 14:19 < rob0> Try adding a few more ##'s?
[07:29] <mrcarrot> what i wrote was more a comment to this
[07:29] <alienBOB> That was a joke
[07:29] <rob0> It's not at all easy to figure out a way to keep out bots while allowing in the real users.
[07:29] <xMDKx> bazinga
[07:29] <alienBOB> Channel flooding is a typical bot behaviour. Our own slackboy bot safeguards against that
[07:29] <mrcarrot> as long as the bots behave... why to care
[07:30] <mwalling> because they dont
[07:30] <raela> what do you mean, of course it's easy.. find who owns the bot and go stab them in the face
[07:30] <mrcarrot> then it is a fast thing to kick it out and ban
[07:30] <mwalling> if an oper is present
[07:30] <mrcarrot> i mean, it is not that often bad bots are comming
[07:30] <alienBOB> We do that, too... ban host masks that are the source of bots
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[07:31] <mrcarrot> i have probably been too little on freenode... but where i have been ircing before i almost never faced a bot. just other rude people i kicked and banned
[07:32] Action: mrcarrot thinks rude people are worst than bots
[07:32] <raela> the really annoying ones, which aren't necessarily bots, are the ones that join and say something obscene.. had one of those recently. problem was, it kept switching ips using webchat, so there was no easy way to prevent it
[07:33] Action: rob0 agrees, but notes that some strange people have strange ideas about what is "rude"
[07:33] <mrcarrot> for me a rude person is somebody not respecting the channel...
[07:34] <Destructo> hey you guys ever see a warning saying the hd isworking outside its parameters ( in ubuntu .. *cough*)
[07:34] <raela> Destructo: no, because I've never used ubuntu. might want to ask there
[07:34] <mrcarrot> for example somebody believing in creation coming into an evolution channel to tell how stupid they are... or somebody beliving in evolution entering a creation channel to tell how stupid they are.
[07:34] <rob0> That's not just rude, that's trolling.
[07:34] <mrcarrot> or to come here and tell how bad they think slackware is just to be rude
[07:35] <mrcarrot> well, trolling is the word
[07:35] <rob0> Unfortunately this channel manages to attract a lot of trolls.
[07:35] <mrcarrot> at least i think trolls are a bigger problem than bots
[07:36] <mrcarrot> it is okay to give some critisim... but not to make it into trolling
[07:37] <alienBOB> Indeed
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[08:09] <adrien> would anyone have noticed erratic behaviour in vim? especially failing to properly "count" lines: when I 'j' or 'k', it moves by two lines and not by one (I've checked these weren't wrapped lines)
[08:10] <mrcarrot> nope, never happened to me
[08:10] <slava_dp> neither to me
[08:10] <mrcarrot> are you sure you do not have problem with your keyboard?
[08:10] <adrien> never had problems before a few weeks ago
[08:10] <sahko> maybe you changed the statusline setting in .vimrc?
[08:10] <adrien> no, don't think so, don't think the problem is between the keyboard and the chair either ;-)
[08:11] <slava_dp> clean the breadcrumbs from under your j and k keys....
[08:11] <adrien> it seems to be almost at random =/
[08:11] <raela> 0 index!
[08:11] <raela> it works fine for me as lon as I start counting at 0 ;/
[08:11] <adrien>  /o\ 
[08:12] <adrien> I'm going to "study" that a bit more next time it happens to me
[08:12] <raela> you damn computer people, making things complicated :P
[08:12] <adrien> indexes starting at 0 are actually easier and have been proven to be less error-prone
[08:13] <mrcarrot> maybe because everybody are used with it
[08:13] <raela> I don't see how it'd be less error prone..
[08:13] <mrcarrot> 16 years ago when i began programming, i had some difficulties in the beginning
[08:13] <raela> "oh need to remove 5 lines.. no wait need to tell vim 4 lines"
[08:13] <adrien> because 0+x = x so you don't have to take it into account
[08:14] <adrien> raela: 5dd
[08:14] <adrien> raela: not 5dj
[08:14] <adrien> err, not 4dj
[08:14] <raela> no, 4dd
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[08:14] <raela> 0, 1, 2, 3, 4.. 5 lines, so tell it 4
[08:14] <adrien> raela: remove 2 lines: 2dd
[08:15] <raela> no, 1 dd
[08:15] <raela> dd removes one line, line 0
[08:15] <raela> 1dd removes 2.. lines 0 and 1
[08:15] <adrien> 2dd removes 2 lines, you number them as you want, you can even number them in klingon, it'll remove 2 lines
[08:16] <alienBOB> raela: incorrect
[08:16] <mrcarrot> 2dd is removing exactly the line you are on + the line under
[08:16] <alienBOB> 1dd removes the current line, no more
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[08:18] <raela> er.. I swear it sometimes goes from index 0 :/ what the hell (yes I just tested it and it went from line 1)
[08:18] <raela> unless this is my mental issues showing up again.. bah
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[08:24] <raela> (I think this shows how complicated a 0 index system is! more errors!)
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[08:37] <skycrash> \o
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[08:41] <skycrash> im using in other machine, slack13.0 and try install cacti.. but show this error for me: [notice] child pid 22745 exit signal Segmentation fault (11)
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[08:44] <skycrash> im using Apache/2.2.15 (Unix) DAV/2 PHP/5.2.12
[08:45] <alienBOB> skycrash: don't you have more logging? The segfault is not enough to point at a cause
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[08:47] <skycrash> alienBOB: in my error_log just show this.. and this [notice] caught SIGTERM, shutting down
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[08:47] <skycrash> when i try open localhost/cacti/install/index.php
[08:48] <skycrash> i download last versions of apache/php, but dont solve problem..
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[08:58] <thumbs> skycrash: unload all the php extension you can manage to.
[08:59] <thumbs> skycrash: i.e. one of them is causing the segfault.
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[09:01] <thumbs> skycrash: if you can, do this: stop httpd, then strace the httpd -X process
[09:02] <thumbs> skycrash: you'll likely find that mpd_php is the culprit. The next step is editing php.ini and unloadinh one extension at a time, until it stops crashing.
[09:03] <skycrash> thumbs: ill try now
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[09:07] <skycrash> thumbs: no have extension enables.. and output from strace... repit this message: write(11, "@\0\0\0\3select value from `cacti`.`s"..., 68) = 68
[09:07] <skycrash> thumbs:  read(11, "-\0\0\1\377z\4#42S02Table 'cacti.setting"..., 16384) = 49
[09:07] <thumbs> skycrash: you have no mod_php extensions loaded? Really?
[09:07] <skycrash> thumbs: poll([{fd=11, events=POLLIN|POLLPRI}], 1, 0) = 0 (Timeout)
[09:07] <thumbs> skycrash: I find that hard to believe.
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[09:08] <sahko> argh kleopatra interaction with konqueror is really pathetic in kde4
[09:09] <sahko> or should i say non existant
[09:09] <skycrash> thumbs: in apache, i have mod_php enables
[09:09] <skycrash> thumbs: in apache, i have mod_php enabled*
[09:09] <skycrash> thumbs: in php, i dont have addictional extension loaded
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[09:11] <thumbs> skycrash: modules are loaded, not enabled.
[09:12] <thumbs> skycrash: unload the mod_php module, and see if it stills segfaults.
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[09:13] <skycrash> thumbs: without  php, works fine.. but the application "cacti" need php..
[09:13] <thumbs> skycrash: prove that you have no mod_php extensions loaded.
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[09:14] <skycrash> thumbs: how?
[09:15] <thumbs> skycrash: with a pastebin. Where do you think mod_php extensions are loaded, exactly?
[09:16] <skycrash> thumbs: LoadModule php5_module        modules/libphp5.so
[09:16] <skycrash> thumbs: in httpd.conf
[09:16] <thumbs> skycrash: that's the mod_php module.
[09:16] <thumbs> skycrash: I'm talking about mod_php extensions.
[09:17] <skycrash> i do a pastebin from my php.ini, just a minute
[09:17] <thumbs> skycrash: php_info() can also help you.
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[09:19] <thumbs> skycrash: I highly recommend asking ##php, to see what mod_php extensions are required, and which ones are not.
[09:19] <pupit> skycrash: i had similar problem, i think php reinstall solved it
[09:19] <pupit> skycrash: and ##apache or ##httpd
[09:19] <slava_dp> thumbs, iirc it's phpinfo()
[09:20] <thumbs> slava_dp: both work. Try it.
[09:20] <slava_dp> I believe you :)
[09:20] <thumbs> pupit: no, #httpd is not the appropriate channel. I'll send him to ##php
[09:20] <thumbs> pupit: re-installing php will not fix the problem.
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[09:21] <thumbs> slava_dp: the php API is inconsistent like that. There are 6 or 7 ways to call each function.
[09:21] <thumbs> pupit: nor is #apache or ##apache, for that matter.
[09:21] <skycrash> thumbs: http://pastebin.com/dEvMjFBM
[09:23] <skycrash> pupit: i have upgraded to last php/apache
[09:23] <skycrash> pupit: and old apache and php is from default installation of slack 13.0
[09:24] <pupit> i remember i had a problem missing libphp5.so too
[09:25] <pupit> but now i cant find the google solution
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[09:25] <skycrash> thumbs: you see my phpinfo? need php.ini too ?
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[09:26] <thrice`> missing linking = you used a package that was compiled against a different shared object than you have
[09:26] <m3tti> symbolic link maybe
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[09:26] <thrice`> (meaning, don't take crap from another version of slackware and expect it to work)
[09:26] <thrice`> m3tti, no
[09:26] <m3tti> hrm ok first idea that came up on me
[09:26] <thrice`> symlinking is a bad idea generally :>
[09:27] <m3tti> had that issue yesterday couldn't find the libcurl.so.3
[09:27] <m3tti> so i linked it to libcurl.so.4 XD i know dirty
[09:27] <thrice`> don't use shitty packages, compile things yourself
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[09:27] <nachox> actually make packages yourself
[09:28] <m3tti> thrice`: libcurle was shipped with slack
[09:28] <m3tti> :'(
[09:28] <GooseYArd> is this channel still full of huge nerds?
[09:28] <thrice`> m3tti, doesn't matter, if you use a package that was built against libcurl.so.3, and you have .so.4, it won't work.  rebuild it yourself to get proper linking
[09:29] <thrice`> this is why you can't use a package from slackware 13.1 on your slackware 10.0 install
[09:29] <slava_dp> GooseYArd, define huge
[09:29] <GooseYArd> :)
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[09:32] <adrien> I'm not *that* fat!
[09:33] <pupit> skycrash: do you have any errors while restarting apache, while php is enabled?
[09:35] <skycrash> pupit: none errors.. the error just show me, while a open http://localhost/cacti/index.php
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[09:36] <thumbs> pupit: FYI, php is not enabled, it's 'loaded'.
[09:37] <skycrash> thumbs: you see my pastebin?
[09:37] <GooseYArd> skycrash: paste it again, I missed it
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[09:37] <skycrash> thumbs: http://pastebin.com/dEvMjFBM
[09:38] <skycrash> thumbs: just phpinfo, you need php.ini too ?
[09:38] <pupit> thumbs: sorry, just wrong term
[09:38] <thumbs> skycrash: yes, you have a bunch of php extensions loaded. Unload one at a time.
[09:38] <thumbs> pupit: yes, apache httpd modules are loaded, php modules are enabled/disabled.
[09:38] <GooseYArd> wheres the error msg
[09:38] <thumbs> GooseYArd: it's a segfault, the last relevant call is from mod_php
[09:39] <thumbs> GooseYArd: it's common. The solution is to unload mod_php extensions.
[09:39] <pprkut> most times it's just bad php coding that causes the segfaults
[09:40] <GooseYArd> presumably he doesnt need mod_php then
[09:40] <pprkut> assuming the file is called index.*php* for a reason...he will
[09:40] <pupit> skycrash: its best to do what thumbs says, unload one at a time extension
[09:41] <thumbs> skycrash: comment out the extensions, one at a time, save php.ini, restartd httpd.
[09:41] <skycrash> thumbs: in my php.ini all lines refer to extensions, is commented
[09:41] <thumbs> GooseYArd: cacti does, unfortunately.
[09:41] <thumbs> skycrash: show us. (only the relevant parts)
[09:41] <thumbs> skycrash: also, zend might cause issues.
[09:42] <GooseYArd> oh i see what you mean now thumbs
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[09:42] <arfon> Hi-dee-ho
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[09:42] <thumbs> skycrash: also, running ldd on the .so module might tell you what it's linked against.
[09:43] <danklesman> anyone here had success getting 32bit flashplayer to work on slackware64?
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[09:44] <arfon> I got 32bit flash player to work on Slamd64 awhile back....
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[09:45] <danklesman> hmm
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[09:45] <duet> does anyone know how to repair an sdcard's filesystem?
[09:45] <zux1wrk> danklesman, why would you need 32bit flashplayer? I think there is a 64bit flashplayer
[09:46] <danklesman> I'm about to kill my arch install and put slackware back on my lappy
[09:46] <zux1wrk> duet, what filesystem does it have?
[09:46] <danklesman> zux1wrk: support by adobe has been droped for their 64bit port
[09:46] <arfon> Congrats Dank
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[09:46] <danklesman> and it has a know security vuln
[09:46] <danklesman> the old alpha 64 one
[09:46] <arfon> Did Adobe ever support their 64bit linux stuff?
[09:46] <duet> zux1wrk: i think its vfat or fat32
[09:47] <danklesman> they had an alpha
[09:47] <skycrash> thumbs: http://pastebin.com/GJ8q4fff
[09:47] <skycrash> thumbs: my php.ini
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[09:47] <arfon> Duet, do you want to REPAIR or just REFORMAT?
[09:47] <thumbs> skycrash: I asked for the relevant sections, btw.
[09:47] <alisonken1home> arfon: they created a 64-bit flash, but last month put a hold on any 64-bit updates
[09:47] <duet> zux1wrk: i have files i need off of it
[09:47] <zux1wrk> and it can't be mounted?
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[09:48] <duet> zux1wrk: when i plug it into the wii the photos come up
[09:48] <thumbs> skycrash: show me the extensions section, ONLY. Nothing else.
[09:48] <arfon> Duet, did you try putting it on a Windoz box and running the filesystem checker?
[09:48] <danklesman> once google gets it into chrome, maybe they will put more work into a 64bit version
[09:48] <skycrash> thumbs: all lines to extensions, are commenteds
[09:48] <danklesman> though to be fair, its only 32bit on windows and mac too afaik
[09:48] <zux1wrk> duet, first thing you should do is dd it to hdd
[09:48] <duet> arfon: windows doesnt see it either
[09:48] <danklesman> anyways... flash sucks
[09:48] <danklesman> lol
[09:48] <GooseYArd> word
[09:49] <arfon> It's probably gone then...
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[09:49] <arfon> If you fdisk it, can you see apartition?
[09:49] <zux1wrk> duet, what do you mean by "doesnt see"
[09:49] <skycrash> thumbs: http://pastebin.com/VjRmxv2Z
[09:49] <skycrash> thumbs: just section extension
[09:49] <zux1wrk> can't see any files, no device inode, nothing in dmesg?
[09:49] <duet> when i plug it into linux it says "FAT: bogus number of reserved sectors
[09:49] <danklesman> duet: does it show a device for it on linux?
[09:49] <zux1wrk> ok
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[09:49] <danklesman> hmm
[09:50] <duet> vfs: fant find a valid FAT filesystem on dev sdc
[09:50] <zux1wrk> first dd it
[09:50] <arfon> duet, did you try fsck.vfat?
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[09:50] <arfon> what zux1wrk said
[09:51] <duet> let me see
[09:51] <zux1wrk> dd first, all else after....
[09:51] <duet> is the command fsck.vfat /dev/sdc?
[09:51] <alisonken1home> dd is nice to clean the drice
[09:51] <alisonken1home> drive
[09:51] <danklesman> that might work duet
[09:51] <zux1wrk> it's also nice to copy the contents of a drive somewhere
[09:51] <adrien> alisonken1home: and to back it up :p
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[09:52] <thumbs> skycrash: ok. Try the ldd route now.
[09:52] <alisonken1home> adrien: for drive mirroring - as long as your destination drive is big enough to hold an image :)
[09:52] <duet> what is the dd command to back it up"?
[09:52] <pprkut> man dd ;)
[09:52] <pprkut> I prefer ddrescue
[09:52] <danklesman> yeah you can use it to back it up duet
[09:52] <zux1wrk> dd if=/dev/sdx of=/home/duet/something
[09:52] <danklesman> dd
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[09:52] <adrien>  | gzip -1 > foo.gz ;p
[09:52] <alisonken1home> dd if=/dev/<drive> of=<destination drive>/<directory><file>.dd
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[09:53] <adrien> or better: lzop instead of gzip
[09:53] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest59047
[09:53] <skycrash> thumbs: ldd /usr/php5/bin/php ?
[09:53] <alisonken1home> ok - dd if=/dev/<drive> | gzip -1 ><destination.file>
[09:53] <adrien>  ^^
[09:53] <zux1wrk> i don't know how big his flash is, but it's probably not worth compressing
[09:53] andrew_46 (~andrew@pdpc/supporter/active/andrew-46) joined ##slackware.
[09:53] <thumbs> skycrash: no, the mod_php module. The .so file.
[09:53] <pupit> zux1wrk: agree
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[09:54] <auska> i'm trying to install virtual box with sbopkg but it gave me these error: Checking for iasl:
[09:54] <auska>   ** iasl (variable IASL) not found!
[09:54] <adrien> a bigger value for bs might make copy faster too (512 is really low ;-) )
[09:54] <auska> what shout i do?
[09:54] <pupit> auska: checking international age, sex, land :P
[09:54] <duet> its just 2 gigs
[09:54] <pprkut> auska: read the README
[09:55] <zux1wrk> duet, then don't compress it
[09:55] <auska> what pupit :S
[09:55] <duet> zux1wrd: ok
[09:55] <pupit> auska IASL
[09:55] <skycrash> thumbs: http://pastebin.com/gaTKXeNe
[09:55] <zux1wrk> and then do the fsck on it
[09:56] <duet> zux1wrk: fsck the backup or the card?
[09:56] <danklesman> the card i'd say
[09:56] <auska> pprkut, i have done it but it don't say anything about isal...
[09:56] <zux1wrk> yes, probably the card
[09:57] <duet> its copying brb
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[09:57] <zux1wrk> at least now if you destroy the flash completely you'll have a place to start over :)
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[09:58] <pprkut> auska: but it says something about other stuff, no?
[09:59] <auska> it says that i have to create a group, something that i have done
[09:59] <auska> and something more that i don't understand...
[09:59] <andrew_46> auska: http://slackbuilds.org/repository/13.1/development/acpica/
[09:59] <pprkut> ... "This requires acpica"  ...
[10:00] <duet> 3970048+0 records in
[10:00] <duet> 3970048+0 records out
[10:00] <duet> 2032664576 bytes (2.0 GB) copied, 300.649 s, 6.8 MB/s
[10:00] <pprkut> there's not much to not understand there
[10:00] <thumbs> skycrash: yes, check every one of those.
[10:00] <thumbs> skycrash: surely, you don't expect me to do that for you?
[10:00] <zux1wrk> duet, well, now do the fsck
[10:00] <duet> so i do fsck /dev/sdc?
[10:00] <danklesman> wiht the "-a" opt yeah
[10:00] <auska> my English isn't perfect at all pprkut ... ok thanks andrew_46 ;)
[10:01] <alisonken1home> I bet /dev/sdc has a partition - so it should be "fsck /dev/sda1"
[10:01] <danklesman> or sdc1
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[10:02] <alisonken1home> "Note that e2fsck(8)  supports  -a for  backwards  compatibility  only.   This option is mapped to e2fsck's -p option which is safe to use, unlike the -a option that some file system checkers support.
[10:02] <alisonken1home> "
[10:02] <pprkut> auska: bad excuse. Even the worst automatic translater can translate you "requires"
[10:02] <alisonken1home> e2fsck - nm
[10:02] <zux1wrk> i don't know, but it's possible that windows has some more advanced or somehow better tools for fat filesystems
[10:03] <skycrash> thumbs: lol
[10:03] <duet> fsck -a /dec/sdc1
[10:03] <duet> fsck from util-linux-ng 2.17.2
[10:03] <duet> /sbin/e2fsck: No such file or directory while trying to open /dec/sdc1
[10:03] Channel flood from duet -- kicking
[10:03] <duet> /dec/sdc1:
[10:03] <duet> The superblock could not be read or does not describe a correct ext2
[10:03] duet kicked from ##slackware by slackboy: flood
[10:03] <slava_dp> haha
[10:03] <alisonken1home> heh
[10:03] <alisonken1home> and he forgot about slackboy
[10:03] <zux1wrk> doesn't fsck support fat?
[10:03] <auska> pprkut, i didn't say that as an excuse... my apologise if i had done something bad...
[10:04] <slava_dp> I presume he didn't know
[10:04] <danklesman> dunix: wait
[10:04] <alisonken1home> fsck -t vfat
[10:04] <slava_dp> zux1wrk, dosfsck
[10:04] <danklesman> i mean dunix
[10:04] <danklesman> err
[10:04] <alisonken1home> or fsck.vfat
[10:04] <zux1wrk> oh
[10:04] <zux1wrk> ok
[10:04] <danklesman> tab fail again
[10:04] <danklesman> lol
[10:04] <danklesman> oh he was kicked
[10:04] <alisonken1home> or what slava_dp said
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[10:04] duet (~duet@71.21.89.86) joined ##slackware.
[10:04] <zux1wrk> there is no fsck.vfat on my system
[10:04] wertik_rus (~wertik@212.57.108.204) joined ##slackware.
[10:04] <alisonken1home> wb
[10:04] <slava_dp> zux1wrk, dosfsck ;)
[10:04] <alienBOB> Next time he joins tell him to use /dev/sdc1 not /dec/sdc1
[10:04] <alisonken1home> duet: it's /dev - not /dec
[10:05] <duet> oops
[10:05] <duet> sorry
[10:05] <alisonken1home> alienBlurb: he just got back
[10:05] <pprkut> auska: nah, no apologise needed. It just gets annoying if people chime in with questions they can find an answer for easily by doing what they are supposed to do anyway. Like reading READMEs :)
[10:05] <alienBOB> O he was back
[10:05] <alisonken1home> alienBOB:
[10:05] <danklesman> dosfsck -a /dev/sdc1 duet
[10:06] wertik_rus (~wertik@212.57.108.204) left irc: Client Quit
[10:06] <duet> dosfsck 2.11, 12 Mar 2005, FAT32, LFN
[10:06] <duet> FATs differ but appear to be intact. Using first FAT.
[10:06] <duet> Performing changes.
[10:06] Channel flood from duet -- kicking
[10:06] <duet> /dev/sdc1: 143 files, 4709/62020 clusters
[10:06] duet kicked from ##slackware by slackboy: flood
[10:06] <slava_dp> interesting.
[10:06] <slava_dp> some people don't learn.
[10:06] <auska> pprkut, ok i will pay more attention to that fact the next time ;)
[10:06] <alisonken1home> when he comes back - someone needs to tell him about slackboy and >3 lines pasted in a short time
[10:06] <pprkut> auska: good :)
[10:07] <andrew_46> pprkut: You maintain virtualbox for slackbuilds.org? Thanks for all your work on this :)
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[10:07] <slava_dp> duet, use a pastebin to paste >3 lines in future.
[10:07] <duet> ok
[10:07] <alisonken1home> duet: slackboy is a bot - and he kicks anyone that pastes more than 3 lines in a short period
[10:07] <alisonken1home> like copy/paste
[10:07] <pprkut> andrew_46: you're welcome :)
[10:08] <duet> so what do i do now
[10:08] <slava_dp> you use the pastebin.
[10:08] <duet> no i mean after the dosfsck command
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[10:08] <slava_dp> we never saw your output.
[10:08] <duet> ok okay
[10:09] <duet> i thought you did
[10:09] <alisonken1home> duet: the part that got pasted shows the fsck was ogod
[10:09] <alisonken1home> good
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[10:09] <slava_dp> (or was that all output? :)
[10:10] <zux1wrk> duet, if the output looked all good, you can try and mount it?
[10:10] <danklesman> run echo $? right after it too
[10:10] <danklesman> it it doesnt tell the exit status
[10:10] <duet> http://pastebin.ca/1901777
[10:10] <duet> yay my first pastebin
[10:11] <danklesman> he
[10:11] <thumbs> skycrash: you said this was an old installation from earlier, right?
[10:11] <danklesman> if you havent run any other commands after the fsck, run "echo $?"
[10:11] <danklesman> duet
[10:11] <thumbs> skycrash: If that is so, I would recommend using the stock package from 13.1, and altering the config files.
[10:11] <duet> danklesman: too late
[10:11] <danklesman> ah
[10:12] <duet> danklesman: i can just run it again
[10:12] <danklesman> ok cool
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[10:12] <danklesman> "echo $?" will tell you the exit status
[10:12] <slava_dp> no point in that
[10:12] <danklesman> the man page for dosfsck shows what each means
[10:13] <slava_dp> mount it, it should be all fine now.
[10:13] <danklesman> yeah probably
[10:14] <skycrash> thumbs: no too old.. six months
[10:14] <skycrash> but, ill try
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[10:14] <duet> still does not work here is what i got http://pastebin.ca/1901780
[10:14] <thumbs> skycrash: a segfault is usually caused by incompatible libraries.
[10:14] <zux1wrk> duet, yes, i also think it's ok, it should have given you some error otherwise
[10:14] <duet> maybe my fstab is wrong
[10:15] <skycrash> thumbs: but.. apache/php is default installation of slack13.0
[10:15] <danklesman> you need to mount /dev/sdc1 duet
[10:15] <slava_dp> duet, mount -t vfat /dev/sdc1 /mnt/tmp
[10:15] <Zordrak> rsync/s progress meter would be a lot more useful if it ever checked more than 1500 files in the future. "to-check" is completely useless; it/s ALWAYS between 1000 and 1200
[10:15] <pprkut> skycrash: /usr/php5 is not used in slackware...
[10:16] <slava_dp> Zordrak, true :)
[10:16] <alisonken1home> skycrash: as noted, segfaults are one of 2 things - either lib mismatch or ram issue
[10:16] <skycrash> pprkut: but, later, i have do a upgrade in php and http, to try solve problem
[10:16] <Zordrak> ive been backing up my work desktop and so for its taken about 5 hours
[10:16] <Zordrak> i have no idea how long is left
[10:16] <slava_dp> Zordrak, why not tar over ssh?
[10:17] <alisonken1home> slava_dp: depends if you want to copy, or keep the 2 sides synced up
[10:18] <Zordrak> slava_dp: its off'line disk'to'disk
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[10:18] <Zordrak> s/'/-/g
[10:19] <thumbs> skycrash: I understand. But the stock packages should not segfault, unless they were altered or misconfigured.
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[10:19] <skycrash> thumbs: i know..
[10:20] <paul424> why does the kde 4.5  does not follow the Xoorg server setttings regarding the alt ctl backspace combination ?
[10:20] <Zordrak> i have too many copies of the kernel source :(
[10:20] <paul424> ok just tell me how to do it ?
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[10:21] <Zordrak> paul424: what do you mean?
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[10:22] <slava_dp> wrt kernel sources, I tend to rebuild patch kernels in the same dir. i. e. I have /usr/src/linux-2.6.32 and I build every subsequent patch in the same dir. works fine :)
[10:22] <alisonken1home> Zordrak: I believe he means "why does kde4.5 NOT kill X when I hit <ctl><backspace>?"
[10:22] <alisonken1home> or ctl-alt-backspace - whatever it is
[10:23] <Zordrak> Does it not?
[10:23] <slava_dp> paul424, switch to a tty, kill X, switch back
[10:23] <paul424> yeap :P
[10:23] <alisonken1home> I've run across instances of it doing that
[10:23] <Roin> alisonken1home: second one is correct :D
[10:23] <paul424> dude I set Xorg correctly , the gnome and other desktops works but not kde
[10:23] <Zordrak> alisonken1home: ick
[10:24] <zux1wrk> duet, any success?
[10:24] <duet> its the weirdest thing i recovered everything and my camera still cannot format the card
[10:24] aborazmeh (~chatzilla@82.137.203.132) joined ##slackware.
[10:24] <zux1wrk> what does your camera say?
[10:25] Mowah (~tree@81-234-104-159-no80.tbcn.telia.com) joined ##slackware.
[10:25] <skycrash> thumbs: thankz for all help.. i go to lunch now
[10:25] <skycrash> thnkz for all
[10:26] <danklesman> duet: you were able to mount it and read it from linux?
[10:26] <slava_dp> duet, you partition table might be screwed. what does 'fdisk -l' say?
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[10:26] <zux1wrk> danklesman, i think "i recovered everything" means that yes, he copied the contents
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[10:27] <paul424> slava_dp: besides sometimes if the cpu is bloated , the alt ctl back used to react faster ... sometimes swtiching to a tty does not work
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[10:27] <slava_dp> paul424, true. I should say, the zap works for me on 4.4.
[10:28] <danklesman> zux1wrk: i was getting a confirmation... i read that much
[10:28] <duet> http://pastebin.ca/1901792
[10:28] <duet> here is the output
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[10:28] <slava_dp> there's also Alt+SysRq+o, which triggers the OOM killer and kills a random app ;-) useful thing.
[10:29] <duet> danklesman: oh and yes i can mount and read from linux
[10:29] <zux1wrk> duet, do the same with /dev/sdc
[10:29] <zux1wrk> oh ne
[10:29] <zux1wrk> sorry, my bad
[10:29] skycrash (sky@189.58.169.43.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br) left ##slackware.
[10:29] <slava_dp> duet, well /dev/sdc looks ok.
[10:29] <duet> how do i format the card
[10:29] <zux1wrk> maybe your camera is broken?
[10:30] <slava_dp> mkdosfs -F16 /dev/sdc1
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[10:30] <slava_dp> that will make it fat16, same as you have now.
[10:30] <slava_dp> -F32 will make it fat32.
[10:30] auska_ (~auska@133.Red-88-19-207.staticIP.rima-tde.net) joined ##slackware.
[10:30] <danklesman> I've had a lot of instances werelinux could read partition data, when other OS's couldn't
[10:31] <duet> what would a 2 gig card normally be
[10:31] <duet> 16 or 32
[10:31] <slava_dp> I'd have it fat32.
[10:31] <alienBOB> 32
[10:31] <alienBOB> No one uses fat16 anymore
[10:31] <danklesman> fat16 maxes at 2GB doesnt it?
[10:31] <slava_dp> floppies use fat12.
[10:32] <arfon> Realmen use fat8
[10:32] <alisonken1home> Real men use butterflies and magnets
[10:33] <Roin> xkcd ftw
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[10:33] <arfon> Mag-core memory FTW!
[10:33] <alisonken1home> and I used to work on some computers that had that
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[10:33] <arfon> Speaking of which, I have my HP2000 emulator compiled and ALMOST working  :)
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[10:33] <Roin> what is a HP2000 emulator?
[10:34] <alisonken1home> and they upgraded to mag spot memory
[10:34] <arfon> It's a program that emulates an HP2000, duh
[10:34] <Roin> that I didnt mean :p
[10:34] <arfon> 'a' HP2000 I meant
[10:34] <alisonken1home> what is an HP2000 then
[10:34] <arfon> HP2000 is a 70's era mini that I learned on
[10:35] <arfon> First computer I actually touched
[10:35] <alisonken1home> it's a box about 2ft square and 3ft tall
[10:35] <arfon> aaahhh, the sweet days of papertape!
[10:35] <Roin> a microcomputer? Oh interesting :D
[10:35] <Roin> AH
[10:35] <arfon> MINI
[10:35] <arfon> not micro
[10:35] <slava_dp> there was a mac mini in the '70s?! cool!
[10:35] <alisonken1home> arfon: and if we were good - they would even let us use mylar tape instead of paper tape :)
[10:35] <Roin> Sorry the 70s were 30 years before my time ._.
[10:35] <arfon> Yeah Slava, it was called Apple I
[10:36] <arfon> You missed out Roin....  Text Star Trek and punching "HAPPY BIRTHDAY ARFON" on the papertape.  :)
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[10:37] <slava_dp> why don't they make custom apples in wood?
[10:37] <slava_dp> apple I design.
[10:37] <arfon> ..and listening to Kraftwerk while doing it on a 300baud acoustic mode....
[10:37] <slava_dp> [in bed]
[10:38] <Roin> arfon: uh nice :D, well I only learned about papertape machines in school :p
[10:38] <arfon> ...I do NOT like Green Eggs and Ham!
[10:38] <duet> thanks for all the help guys you are all lifesavers
[10:38] <Zordrak> 744000 files and still going....
[10:38] <slava_dp> Zordrak, you should have gotten rid of the sources :)
[10:38] <Zordrak> and sbopkg data
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[10:38] <arfon> I still have some rolls of paper tape with some of my programs somewhere... IF I COULD ONLY FIND THAT ELUSIVE ASR33!
[10:39] <arfon> <--looking for an ASR33
[10:41] <alisonken1home> http://www.vintagecomputer.net/univac1219.cfm <-- one of the systems I worked on - and we used magtape and papertape on it
[10:41] <arfon> [eyes Alison]
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[10:41] <arfon> Do you have an ASR33 buried in one of your closets that I can have?
[10:42] <alisonken1home> sorry - asr33 was not a designated military combat computer :)
[10:42] <arfon> :(   That makes me sad
[10:45] <alisonken1home> http://www.dluper.com/CP642B.html <-- thtat's the other computer I worked on
[10:45] <alisonken1home> notice the bottom right picture :)
[10:46] <alisonken1home> that was one bit plane
[10:46] <Zordrak> WOOOO. FINALLY done backing up.
[10:46] <Zordrak> to be fair it takes so long because both source and destination are encrypted
[10:47] <alisonken1home> each chassis had 6 bit planes - 5 for data and 1 for spare - total of 5 memory chassis for 30-bit computer word
[10:47] <panzer> bit on the old side
[10:48] <alisonken1home> yeah - 1950's technology that was still in use in 1993
[10:48] <panzer> damn
[10:48] <alisonken1home> but they finally upgraded just after I left
[10:48] <alisonken1home> but hey - it worked :)
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[10:49] <panzer> yea shows not everything needs quad quad core
[10:50] y3llow (~y3llow@111-240-206-77.dynamic.hinet.net) joined ##slackware.
[10:50] <slava_dp> Zordrak, your work computer is encrypted? what for?
[10:50] <alisonken1home> of course, special purpose systems like a combat systems doesn't really change frequently either - especially since they make sure it works before it goes out to the ships
[10:51] <GooseYArd> maybe he works in alaska and needs to keep the cpu from freezing
[10:52] <Zordrak> slava_dp: Because when companies go into administration, it is usual for administrators to prevent employees from ever accessing computer equipment. If the disks are encrypted I never have to worry about anyone getting at my data so long as I get the machine powered off.
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[10:53] Nick change: Guest59047 -> RaNdY
[10:54] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest62097
[10:54] <SigmaVirus24> can anyone give me some tips for building something from source that is not on SBo? (since SBo is about the extent of my experience)
[10:54] <slava_dp> http://slackbuilds.org/templates/
[10:54] <alisonken1home> follow the instructions in the README that comes with it - the use the same steps in the slackbuild that you create
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[10:55] <SigmaVirus24> thanks
[10:55] <SigmaVirus24> (@ both of you)
[10:56] <arfon> Sorry Alison, work got all in my face and pulled me away from the chat, what were you saying about that old computer system with 30 backplanes and a margarita mixer?
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[10:57] <alisonken1home> we wished it had a margarita mixer :) remember, this is uncle sam's canoe club, not the britsh yacht club
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[10:57] <alisonken1home> arfon: ^^
[10:58] <arfon> I was in Uncle Sam's canoe club, I was a rower!
[10:58] <arfon> Still have the whip marks on my back
[10:58] |Slacker| (~cris@189.26.10.243.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[10:58] <alisonken1home> I was there for 21 years
[10:59] <arfon> You sure out did me!  I could only stand 6
[10:59] <alisonken1home> :)
[10:59] <alisonken1home> all service is appreciated - but it is a lifestyle that you have to tolerate
[11:00] <arfon> No it's the idiots above you making your life unnecessarily dificult that you have to tolerate
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[11:00] <alisonken1home> both :)
[11:00] <arfon> The life style wasn't too bad  :)
[11:00] <arfon> I like blue and gray :)
[11:01] <arfon> (don't care much for fish-stick chilli though)
[11:01] <Roin> Uhm question: if I want to start bluetoothd by default, should I simply add "bluetoothd" to /etc/rc.d/rc.local?
[11:01] <Roin> by default= on startup
[11:01] <oobe> Hi i just changed my ssid and now i cant connect to my router, it appears to of authenticated and associated when i check iwconfig and dmesg. I'm using wpa and i changed the ssid in wpa_supplicant all seems ok any idea's?
[11:01] <arfon> no
[11:01] <mako-sama> no
[11:01] <mako-sama> Roin: just chmod +x /etc/rc.d/rc.bluetooth
[11:01] <arfon> chmod 755 /etc/rc.d/rc.bluetooth
[11:02] <Roin> Oh thats enough?
[11:02] <mako-sama> should be
[11:02] <arfon> Partially
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[11:02] <mako-sama> Roin: and edit the configuration file
[11:02] <slava_dp> bye all, workday is over. see ya.
[11:02] <alisonken1home> you still have to do some configuration for bluetooth
[11:02] <mako-sama> files, actually
[11:02] <arfon> That will start the system, if you want to automatically pair two devices, you have to do a little more
[11:03] <slava_dp> blueman will come up automatically.
[11:03] <Roin> Well I started bluetoothd manually and used the bluettoth app from KDE to establish a connection already
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[11:04] <arfon> I automatically pair with an rc.local command that says: rfcomm bind 00:1B:DC:50:08:F5 1
[11:05] <Roin> arfon: but if I just use the applet from KDE, it is enough to just make rc.bluetooth executable isnt it?
[11:05] <mako-sama> qyes
[11:06] <Roin> ok thats what I wanted to know, thank you two very much :D
[11:06] <arfon> Yes, you can use Blueman in KDE and just make rc.bluetooth X
[11:06] <Roin> I just need it to share things between my mobile phone and my netbook, so it is not always clear if I connect to it all of the time
[11:07] <arfon> I do mine so I autoconnect without blueman
[11:07] <Roin> Ok I see :D
[11:07] <arfon> NEXT, I'm going to add a udev rule so that whenever I plug in my bluetooth adapter, it will autopair  :)
[11:08] <arfon> BTW, does anyone know how to write a udev rule that will run a script when a specific device is plugged in???  :))
[11:08] <arfon> (JK)
[11:08] <Roin> Well bluetooth is buil in into this thingy
[11:08] <Roin> built*
[11:09] <mako-sama> arfon: sure... shouldn't be hard to do
[11:10] <arfon> One other thing you should know, there is a couple of Bluez commands that you should use to get the built-in adapter's ID and local adapters ID so you can set up the pairing also.
[11:10] <gnubien> arfon: this works for alsa and usb sound card...
[11:10] <gnubien> arfon try the udev.command.at.unplug.usb example asoundrc files at http://home.roadrunner.com/~infofiles/asoundrc.examples.html but read the faq first
[11:10] <arfon> Most of the webpages you will find reference the old command, it has since 'changed names'
[11:11] <arfon> Thanks gnubian
[11:11] <gnubien> arfon: or just read that example asoundrc to see how udev is used
[11:11] <arfon> I've hacked my way through udev rules before with much pain so I know it's doable....
[11:12] <arfon> WHY OH WHY, can't I be a computer Idiot Savant???????
[11:12] <gnubien> arfon: yea, doable
[11:12] <gnubien> arfon: what kind of device?
[11:13] <gnubien> arfon: bluetooth device?
[11:13] <arfon> a tiny USB to Bluetooth adapter...  when I plug it in, I just want it to run a script: /root/blue2serial-on.sh
[11:13] <alphageek> arfon: half way there? :)
[11:13] <gnubien> arfon: http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/bluetooth-guide.xml
[11:14] <gnubien> arfon: http://wiki.bluez.org/wiki/HOWTO/AudioDevices
[11:14] <arfon> Well, right now, on boot, RC.local runs the script which works but, when I'm not on the bluetooth-rs232 connection, I keep getting annoying Getty respawn messages
[11:15] <arfon> And there doesn't seem to be away to stop the respawn messages
[11:15] <gnubien> arfon: in kde try kbluetooth, reported to work very well
[11:16] <arfon> I need to do this without KDE...
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[11:16] <gnubien> arfon: kbluetooth may give you some hints
[11:17] <gnubien> arfon: there is an example asoundrc named bluetooth.asoundrc at that url i posted
[11:17] <arfon> When I am at work (like now), I can't have my laptop out and open so, I just stick it in my desk and sturn it on.  The scripts bring up the bluetooth and connects to a secret blue-RS232 adapter I have on my desktop....  :)
[11:18] <arfon> I am going to check them out at lunch Gnubian...  THANKS!
[11:19] <gnubien> arfon maybe someone at the alsa mailing list can help so search this site for your card or problem and ask in the alsa mailing list: http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net
[11:19] <arfon> Um Gnubian, I think you have me confused, I'm not having a soundcard problem...
[11:19] <gnubien> oops, ok
[11:20] <arfon> I just wantto write a udev rule for a usb/bluetooth adapter
[11:20] <arfon> But, thanks for the attention. :)
[11:20] <gnubien> arfon sure, have fun
[11:20] <arfon> Sound works great (except, why does alsa ALWAYS have a low volume problem)???
[11:21] <mako-sama> arfon: alsamixer > raise volume to what you want
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[11:22] <arfon> Doesn't work, I can max out the volumes and the volume will still be lower in Linux than when I boot into Winders....
[11:22] <arfon> it seems to be an alsa quirk
[11:22] <Roin> sure? dont forget to max out PCM as well?
[11:23] <arfon> Yep, even PCM
[11:23] <gnubien> arfon: tried any alsa model options when alsa starts?
[11:23] <arfon> No gnubian
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[11:23] <arfon> I should though
[11:23] <gnubien> arfon: alsa model options are based on the version of alsa drivers you have installed and the codec of your sound card
[11:23] <arfon> Anyone else notice this?
[11:24] <gnubien> arfon sure, have fun
[11:24] <gnubien> arfon: cat /proc/asound/card0/codec#0
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[11:25] <gnubien> arfon: that command prints the codec of the sound card usually
[11:25] <gnubien> arfon run this command and it is OK to paste the output in this channel: cat /proc/asound/version
[11:25] <arfon> I sound like a whiner, let me say that even with the volume thingie, ALSA is a vast improvement over the soundcard hell that we had to go through before ALSA
[11:25] <gnubien> yea, vastly improved now
[11:25] <arfon> Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version 1.0.21.
[11:26] <gnubien> codec?
[11:26] <arfon> And don't even get me started on praising CUPs
[11:26] <arfon> Gnubian, that was the total output
[11:26] <gnubien> cat /proc/asound/card0/codec#0
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[11:27] Nick change: Sauron -> BiCHiTo
[11:27] <arfon> Yeah, I can't paste that output, I'll ge kicked for spamming everyone's computers off the IRC
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[11:27] <gnubien> pastebin
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[11:29] <arfon> I can't ATM gunbian...  I'm going through a TINY (5pt font) terminal window using console only.  Lynx is PAINFUL
[11:29] <arfon> Sound works, it's just the speaker volume is lower than it should be
[11:30] <gnubien> arfon: cat /proc/asound/card0/codec#0 |grep "odec:"
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[11:31] <arfon> Codec: Realtek ALC272
[11:32] <arfon> That worked well.
[11:32] <gnubien> arfon: search for the model options for your sound cards codec at http://home.roadrunner.com/~infofiles/models/model.options.for.alsa.21
[11:32] <gnubien> arfon: search for 272
[11:34] <gnubien> arfon: in that url its listed as: ALC662/663/272
[11:35] <bitlord> gnubien, I think I have same problem like arfon, but now don't have windows to try. I think there was louder sound.
[11:36] <gnubien> bitlord how old is your PC? days? weeks? months? years?
[11:36] <bitlord> I have ALC888
[11:36] <bitlord> ~2.5years
[11:36] <bitlord> maybe less
[11:37] <gnubien> search for 888 at http://home.roadrunner.com/~infofiles/models/model.options.for.alsa.21 if you have alsa drivers 1.0.21 installed
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[11:37] <bitlord> 1.0.23 I have in 13.1
[11:38] <gnubien> search for 888 at http://home.roadrunner.com/~infofiles/models/model.options.for.alsa.23 if you have alsa drivers 1.0.23 installed
[11:38] <bitlord> found
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[11:39] <gnubien> bitlord: your pc listed in any of those model options for 888?
[11:40] <bitlord> I think NO, I build my self machine, I have GA-MA56S-S3 mobo
[11:41] <gnubien> bitlord  what is the total number of jacks that can be plugged into your sound card? 0,1,2,3,4,5,6? example: jack on the left and plug on the right at: http://www.atpm.com/14.04/images/iphone-04-headphone-jack-ad.jpg
[11:42] <bitlord> 6 rear and 2 front, 8
[11:42] <arfon> Sorry Gnubian, had a work flare up there
[11:42] <gnubien> bitlord: run alsamixer and see if you have any 'spdif' or 'iec958' controls listed there
[11:43] <bitlord> 2 spdif
[11:44] <gnubien> bitlord run this command and then paste output to this channel: cat /proc/asound/modules
[11:45] <bitlord> only this one,  0 snd_hda_intel
[11:45] <gnubien> bitlord: as root edit this file: /etc/modprobe.d/modprobe.conf  and add this line to the bottom of the file: option snd-hda-intel model=6stack-dig
[11:46] <gnubien> bitlord: you need to reboot to test the model option but no hurry on rebooting
[11:46] <bitlord> don't have modprobe.conf, need to create it?
[11:47] <gnubien> bitlord: if the card works better then great, if not, remove that line from that file
[11:47] <alisonken1home> it's no longer modprobe.conf - it's /etc/modprobe.d/sound.conf
[11:47] <gnubien> bitlord: yea, create it
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[11:47] <gnubien> bitlord: alisonken1home maybe right, dunno
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[11:48] <bitlord> I have /etc/modprobe.d/sound  with some alias lines
[11:48] <bitlord> just sound without .conf
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[11:48] <alisonken1home> bitlord: rename it from sound to sound.conf - otherwise you'll get info that "in the future all files must end in conf"
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[11:49] <bitlord> OK, tnx. alisonken1home
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[11:50] <bitlord> OK, now reboot, or I can unload and load module again, or something like that?
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[11:50] <FriedBob> I'm talkling with my sysadmin about one of our servers, and he's like "I only have 32 [gigs of ram]". My, how far we have come.
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[11:50] <alisonken1home> bitlord: reboot is easier
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[11:51] <gnubien> bitlord: kde,gnome,and xfce have their own alsa apps so you cant use command line, the command is as root: modprobe snd-hda-intel model=6stack-dig
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[11:51] <bitlord> OK, now using wmaker only
[11:52] <gnubien> bitlord: ok, try the modprobe command after you close all sound apps, mixers and firefox
[11:53] <bitlord> hm, WARNING in /etc/modprobe.d/sound.conf  ignoring bad line starting with 'option', something like thata :(
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[11:54] <gnubien> yep, create the modprobe.conf file and add that option line
[11:54] <bitlord> ok
[11:54] <gnubien> bitlord: remove the option line from the 'sound' or sound.conf file
[11:54] Nick change: Guest62097 -> RaNdY
[11:55] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest39875
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[11:56] <bitlord> hm, same problem with modprobe.conf :(
[11:56] <alisonken1home> gnubien: man modprobe.conf: "the /etc/modprobe.conf file can also be used if it exists, but that will be removed in a future
[11:56] <alisonken1home>        version"
[11:56] <alisonken1home> use "options" instead of "option" <-- note the "s" on the end
[11:56] <gnubien> bitlord: oops, word should be 'options' and not 'option'
[11:57] <alisonken1home> and use /etc/modprobe.d/sound.conf
[11:57] <alisonken1home> might as well get used to it now since modprobe.conf is going away
[11:57] <arfon> Soo, Bitlord, your nick got me thinking...  How much is 2bits? Well, I have the answer-  a bit is 1/8 of a dollar or 12.5cents
[11:57] <arfon> A short bit is 10cents and a long bit is 15cents
[11:57] <bitlord> LOL
[11:57] <bitlord> gnubien, OK, no problem
[11:58] <gnubien> bitlord: try it from command line first to see if it helps, then edit file as needed: modprobe snd-hda-intel model=6stack-dig
[11:59] <bitlord> I think I need to reboot tried to rmmod some modules and it stuck, I can't kill rmmod :( (n00B) :(
[11:59] <arfon> you should change your nick to 12_5centlord  :)
[12:00] <arfon> ..or maybe 12_5centnoob?
[12:00] <arfon> [crickets]
[12:01] <bitlord> http://nopaste.ns-linux.org/?MjcwZW
[12:02] <bitlord> arfon, that's good 12_5centnoob
[12:02] <bitlord> just like me
[12:02] <arfon> :)
[12:03] <bitlord> arfon, look at the paste, what n00b can do to safe,stable slackware :(
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[12:03] Action: bitlord is idiot
[12:03] <arfon> I can't bit, pastebin is too painful in 5pt Lynx
[12:04] <arfon> Aww, no you're not
[12:04] <jeev> you're all idiots!
[12:04] <arfon> You're using Slackware so you're at least smarter than most Ubun...Linux users
[12:04] <bitlord> jeev, :D
[12:04] <arfon> Quiet in the back row
[12:04] <jeev> after helping my friend try hackintosh on his desktop, im tired of seeing panics
[12:04] <jeev> mine works just fine
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[12:05] <alisonken1home> heh
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[12:05] <arfon> Is Slackintosh dead?
[12:05] <jeev> there was a slackintosh? damn
[12:05] <alisonken1home> not officially supported any more last I heard - but it's not dead
[12:06] <arfon> Kinda like a zombie eh?
[12:06] <panzer> anyone using alpine?
[12:06] <arfon> I'm trying to Panzer
[12:06] <thrice`> their changelog shows activity, but nothing much for releases
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[12:06] <arfon> but, I'm not having much luck
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[12:11] <panzer> arfon: I am trying to setup for gmail.
[12:11] <arfon> In my searches, I believe I saw a setup for alpine and gmail....
[12:12] <panzer> yea I have found something.  I am trying now.
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[12:12] <arfon> Alpine is very annoying...
[12:13] <arfon> you pretty much need a pop app (fetchmail) and an MDA (procmail) to use it.
[12:13] <arfon> ..at least that's what I learned
[12:14] <panzer> well I was going imap. Which I think alpine supports native.
[12:14] <arfon> Alpine SUPPOSEDLY supports POP now but, it doesn't SEEM to completely support it...
[12:15] <arfon> I e-mailed the maintainer and he responded but was useless
[12:15] <arfon> and documentation... heh
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[12:16] <TGM> hi guys
[12:16] <arfon> But,it is FREE so, I can't b!tch too much
[12:16] <arfon> Hi TGM
[12:16] <TGM> i got a huge problem with one of my servers and it's bugging me for about 2 years now
[12:16] <TGM> every few months my filesystem dies X_X
[12:16] <arfon> The maintainer of Alpine has a page of 'modules' you can add to alpine to make it do more.
[12:17] <TGM> with slacx 13_64
[12:17] <alisonken1home> which filesystem?
[12:17] <arfon> Is that a Checz version Slaxcx?
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[12:18] <TGM> ext3 and 4, in both it does the same
[12:18] <arfon> Cechz  and Slacx....  I ruined that one didnt I?
[12:18] <TGM> nono, official one, no repack
[12:18] <alisonken1home> what kind of drives?
[12:18] <TGM> default?
[12:18] <alisonken1home> scsi - sata - ide - rll - etc.
[12:18] <TGM> oh, sata
[12:19] <arfon> when you say 'dies', what do you mean?
[12:19] <BP{k}> TGM: 1) define "dies" 2) you say you have this problem for several years ... uhm . bad disk?
[12:19] <alisonken1home> we use sata in the datacenter with hardware raid - other than using cheap seagate drives, we haven't had issues with sata
[12:19] Nick change: _Divine -> Divine
[12:19] <panzer> arfon: I have gotten my imap stuff down and it looks like I can have two accounts.
[12:20] <TGM> 1) the filesystem becomes read-only, and i have to run multiple system cheks and reboots, somethimes system reinstall to make it work, 2) i tryed with 3 diffrent hard drivers, one of them new, it's not a HDD problem
[12:20] <panzer> alisonken1home: use the enterprise drives?
[12:20] <arfon> Panzer: Great!  Fix my Alpine problems now  :)
[12:21] <alisonken1home> panzer: we have some, but the company is building out like crazy, so we're using the basic drives for now until we can afford the enterprise drives
[12:21] <TGM> @alisonken1home no it's just a simple sata 2 HDD, no raid on any of them
[12:22] <arfon> TGM: Anything in your Logs?
[12:22] <Zordrak> any idea where Mutt stores state data>
[12:23] <TGM> well mysql is the first to die so.. this is the first error i notice http://pastebin.com/j3tGidca
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[12:25] <alisonken1home> TGM: what does "cat /sys/block/<drive>/queue/scheduler" show?
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[12:26] <alisonken1home> where <drive> would be something like sda, sdb, -
[12:26] <TGM> i unmounted my HDD's now, but this is the output "noop anticipatory deadline [cfq]"
[12:27] <arfon> mine says: noop deadline [cfq]
[12:29] <TGM> according to http://www.linuxhowtos.org/System/iosched.htm it's ok
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[12:31] <panzer> arfon: pm?
[12:31] <panzer> alisonken1home: got you.
[12:31] <arfon> Panzer, if I knew how to on IRSSI, I would...
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[12:33] <TGM> any ideea what may put the filesystem out of comission?
[12:33] <arfon> Cheap chinese SATA adapter cards
[12:33] <panzer> arfon: Got that one?
[12:33] <alisonken1home> TGM: may be ok - but we've been having issues with drives, and found noop seems to work better for high-i/o processes
[12:33] <arfon> panzer: no.
[12:33] <panzer> look at your channels list.  You see a new one?
[12:33] <panzer> maybe showing red?
[12:35] <TGM> chaning the schreduler think will solve the problems?
[12:35] <alisonken1home> won't know till you test it
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[12:35] <TGM> ok, i'll try
[12:35] <TGM> thanks for the advice
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[12:36] Action: arfon is in CTRLA+3,ALT4 hell
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[12:36] <kumo> Hi everyone. I'v got some question. I tried to connect to irc by xchat using SSL, but got message: AutoLoad failed for: /usr/lib64/xchat/plugins/tcl.so  This file exists... In what may be a problem?
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[12:41] <adaptr> foo ?
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[12:42] <jeev> znc ? jhmm
[12:42] <jeev> i welcome a new bnc.
[12:43] <kumo> emm... and who/what is bnc? ^^''
[12:44] <jeev> http://en.znc.in/wiki/ZNC
[12:47] <kumo> jeev, thx, I didn't about it =)
[12:48] <fredoslack> hello
[12:48] <kumo> hi
[12:48] <alisonken1home> yo  fredoslack
[12:49] <fredoslack> do gtk' windows in kde can have the theme og kde please ?
[12:49] <fredoslack> of *
[12:49] <fredoslack> hello kumo  alisonken1home
[12:49] <fredoslack> "qt-gtk"
[12:50] <alisonken1home> there's supposed to be a harmonizing project to allow gtk and qt programs to work with each other's libs
[12:50] <alisonken1home> not sure how far along it is
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[12:50] <fredoslack> for exemple, i would want, with kde, that xchat looks like a kde application
[12:50] <TGM> according to wikipedia Noop is used only for SDD drivers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noop_scheduler
[12:51] <fredoslack> alisonken1home, snif it's bien regrettable lol
[12:51] <alisonken1home> TGM: ok - could be because we're using hardware raid (second paragraph)
[12:52] <TGM> yea
[12:52] <bitlord> fredoslack, tried qtcurve?
[12:52] <alisonken1home> however - on high i/o loads, cfq can hurt you
[12:52] <fredoslack> bitlord,  yes, it's work nice !
[12:53] <fredoslack> i'me going to install it, i think
[12:53] <TGM> i've just made a system scan, can you figure something out of this http://pastebin.com/Xj0FK5bt ?
[12:53] <alisonken1home> one way to check is iostat and see what the iowait percentage is over time (I like to use iowait -x 3)
[12:53] <bitlord> fredoslack, It's easy, and look's OK
[12:53] <fredoslack> yes
[12:53] <fredoslack> i'm going to watch in salix' repository,
[12:54] <fredoslack> there is gnome hihi
[12:54] <fredoslack> bon hop bye ici !
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[12:54] <TGM> you mean iostat -x 3 probably, i don't have iowait
[12:54] <alisonken1home> iostat :)
[12:55] <TGM> what should i be looking after?
[12:55] Nick change: Guest39875 -> RaNdY
[12:55] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest88886
[12:55] <alisonken1home> r/s and w/s and see if one of them is getting starved - and i%iowait being high
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[12:57] <TGM> needs a reboot to enter production, 2 min
[12:57] <TGM> only 49 days uptime this time :)
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[13:10] <nachox> TGM, uptime is not a measure of efficiency, it just outlines how bad the patching policy of a given site is
[13:11] <dustybin> in the future my server will hold 6x 2TB storage drives
[13:11] <dustybin> should i configure the 6x 2TB storage drives using soft RAID-6
[13:11] <dustybin> or should i setup two 3x 2TB soft RAID-5 arrays
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[13:11] <dustybin> the storage will be for Mutimedia files, like HD Video, Music etc
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[13:12] <arfon> Dusty, if you're going to spend that much money, why not get a 3ware card and be safe?
[13:13] <alisonken1home> Areca is better than 4-ware
[13:13] <alisonken1home> 3-ware
[13:13] <arfon> Never used Areca, have used 3-ware, they rock
[13:13] <dustybin> linux raid is better than controllers
[13:13] <arfon> Why do you like Areca?
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[13:14] <arfon> I disagree Dusty
[13:14] <alisonken1home> we've got LSI, 3-Ware, and Areca cards- and so far the Areca's don't bork the drives as much
[13:14] <dustybin> http://linux.yyz.us/why-software-raid.html
[13:14] <alisonken1home> areca's are also easier to rebuild the raid
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[13:14] <dustybin> i really dont need a controller card for home use... surely not
[13:14] <arfon> I had someone running Linux raid have their array crap out, NEVER had an array fail on a 3-ware card
[13:14] <alisonken1home> dustybin: depends on what you can afford in a raid - sotware raid doesn't help if you have to pull the power cord
[13:15] <dustybin> my server stays on 24.7
[13:15] <dustybin> UPS
[13:15] <arfon> ..until battery goes bad
[13:16] <alisonken1home> we have several hundreds of servers that are supposed to stay on 24-7, but due to customer-installed extras and some kernel regressions, we end up having to powercycle some of the machines in order to get them to get back to a  normal state
[13:16] <dustybin> linux raid is better than all budget RAID cards
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[13:16] <arfon> Raid card is SOOO easier. You boot, go into raid bios, setup the array and then your machine sees it as a normal drive.
[13:16] <alisonken1home> dustybin: then you haven't priced some of the lsi/areca/3-ware cards that we have
[13:16] <arfon> I didn't say budget
[13:17] <arfon> 3-ware is a little pricey
[13:17] <arfon> but for $250, you can get a good card
[13:17] <dustybin> that could buy me 2x hard drives
[13:17] <dustybin> surely i dont need a controller card
[13:17] <arfon> yes, and you can lose all of your data on those 2x drives
[13:17] <alisonken1home> however - software raid doesn't protect your data as well as you think it does
[13:18] <dustybin> i cannot find any linux raid nightmares on googles hardly at all
[13:18] <arfon> You don't NEED a card but, you're buying 6X 2Tb drives, they are costly
[13:18] <alisonken1home> you will not find any serous server farms using software raid
[13:18] <dustybin> i will buy 3x 2tb to start off with
[13:18] <dustybin> then another 3x when i require more space
[13:19] <arfon> Dusty, Linux RAID is better than nothing, go for it. I just made a comment that if your's going to spend so much money on this project, why not spend a little more and do it right?
[13:19] <dustybin> buying a controller card doesnt mean its doing it right?
[13:19] <arfon> If you want it to be a file server/storage, then yes
[13:19] <alisonken1home> dustybin: the discussion was software raid v. hardware riad
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[13:20] <alisonken1home> and software raid is not for something you want proper data protection with
[13:21] <dustybin> what is the difference between using a hardware card and software ?
[13:21] <arfon> Dusty, again, if you want to do software RAID, go for it....  It's better than no RAID but one other thing to consider...  Good RAID cards have individual ports, motherboards usually have one port with a bunch of channels...
[13:21] <alisonken1home> other than you're becoming a win-raid where the computer has to control all functions of the hard drives v. a dedicated card that can guarantee the data gets to the drives in case of error?
[13:22] <arfon> Therefore is one drive goes out and crashes the port, your RAID is worthless
[13:22] <alisonken1home> and hardware raid offloads the drive functionality off the cpu so it can do other things like it's supposed to
[13:22] <arfon> Like rendering pr0n
[13:23] <arfon> [looks around]
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[13:26] <SigmaVirus24> Quick question: How do I set up slack so that polipo runs on startup?
[13:26] <arfon> vi /etc/rc.d/rc.local
[13:26] <shonudo> you can add stuff to rc.local SigmaVirus24
[13:26] <shonudo> or what arfon just noted
[13:26] <shonudo> :)
[13:26] <SigmaVirus24> right
[13:27] <arfon> FRIST POST!
[13:27] <SigmaVirus24> ok thanks
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[13:27] <shonudo> lol@arfon
[13:27] SigmaVirus24 (~WhoAmI@24-196-69-180.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com) left irc: Client Quit
[13:27] <shonudo> that was quick
[13:28] <shonudo> he was serious
[13:28] <arfon> Gotta love efficiency
[13:28] Action: arfon was just happy to get a question he knew the answer to.
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[13:31] Nick change: _Divine -> neBu
[13:31] <arfon> Sounds like a Start Wars character
[13:31] <arfon> Meesa talks to neBu
[13:31] <arfon> Start=Star
[13:32] <shonudo> i liked start wars :P
[13:32] <neBu> :)
[13:32] <arfon> Oh, a warmonger eh?  :)
[13:32] <shonudo> tied in to the startup question raised earlier
[13:32] <kumo> =))
[13:33] <arfon> echo "Attack neighbor" >> /etc/rc.d/rc.local ?
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[13:33] <kumo> I've found what the problem was
[13:33] <arfon> ...and the answer was?
[13:34] <kumo> I am idiot >< TCL hadn't been istalled ><
[13:34] <arfon> (Don't say '42')
[13:34] Action: dustybin feels RAIDed out
[13:34] <kumo> :-D
[13:34] <arfon> HA HA!!! I hate dependencies
[13:34] <dustybin> have i done the wrong thing by using software RAID 1 for my system drive?
[13:34] <arfon> Is it working Dusty?
[13:34] <dustybin> yes perfectly
[13:35] <arfon> Then, I would say "no'
[13:35] <dustybin> md0 : active raid1 sda1[0] sdc1[1]
[13:35] <dustybin> why is software RAID dangerous?
[13:35] <dustybin> could i suddenly lose all my data?
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[13:36] <arfon> 1) It shares ports on controllers for multiple drives
[13:36] <arfon> 2) It slows down the system by loading the CPU
[13:36] <SigmaVirus24> Anyone here familiar with polipo?
[13:36] <arfon> 3) If your system fails, you may lose your RADI data
[13:37] <dustybin> im doomed :(
[13:37] <arfon> Sigma, you only get 1 question here...
[13:37] <arfon> No your'e not Dusty
[13:37] <arfon> You are safer than me with no RAID
[13:37] <SigmaVirus24> i don't believe you arfon
[13:37] <arfon> :(
[13:37] <SigmaVirus24> :P
[13:38] <SigmaVirus24> it's just that it's not running on startup
[13:38] <SigmaVirus24> i'm thinking i might have to use a shell script to get the fucker running
[13:38] <arfon> Dusty, since you are mirroring, you'll be fine....
[13:39] <arfon> The software RAID problems really occure with striping
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[13:39] <arfon> Sounds good Sigma...
[13:39] <shonudo> SigmaVirus24, what did you put in rc.local?
[13:39] <arfon> As a matter of fact, with mirroring, you are MUCH safer than my single drive, no RAID setup.
[13:40] <SigmaVirus24> if [ -x /etc/rc.d/rc.polipo ]; then /etc/rc.d/rc.polipo start fi
[13:40] <shonudo> hmmm... not sure you need the if/then protocol
[13:40] <arfon> did you chmod 755 /etc/rc.d/rc.philipo?
[13:40] <alisonken1home> is /etc/rc.d/rc.polip executable? ls -l /etc/rc.d/rc.polipo
[13:40] <SigmaVirus24> but if I do /etc/rc.d/rc.polipo start from the commandline it says no command found
[13:41] <SigmaVirus24> shit
[13:41] <SigmaVirus24> sorry
[13:41] <dustybin> if your system fails, you still might lose your data using a RAID controller card?
[13:41] <arfon> [blinks]
[13:41] <SigmaVirus24> always forget that crap
[13:41] <SigmaVirus24> *still a newb*
[13:41] <arfon> Ye, it's possible Dusty
[13:41] <alisonken1home> dustybin: possibly - but you stand a better chance with hardware raid - especially if there's a battery on the card
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[13:41] <dustybin> onboard controllers have independent ports for every drive
[13:41] <dustybin> this is not IDE
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[13:42] <dustybin> and CPU is not a issue in this day and age
[13:42] <arfon> dusty, are you SURE that A Number 1 Chinese MotherBoard Inc did that?
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[13:42] <alisonken1home> dustybin: depends on how loady the server is :)
[13:42] <dustybin> its for home use, so not loady at all
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[13:44] <arfon> Let me clarify my earlier statement...  Good RAID cards have seperate controllers for each drive, cheap ones/mother boards have one controller
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[13:45] <arfon> Dusty, again, you're worrying about this too much, go with your original plan. It will work fine for your needs
[13:46] <arfon> "loady"?   is that a new parameter?
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[13:46] <arfon> "My cpu runs at 231Gig-loadies"
[13:46] <shonudo> i think it's a technical term like "thingy"
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[13:47] <alisonken1home> arfon: "uptime" and read the part that says "load average" :)
[13:47] <arfon> ...or "Flops"?
[13:47] <alisonken1home> I consistently get servers in the 500 to 2K load range (bad user scripts)
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[13:48] <arfon> What are you saying about your ability to write scripts there Alison?
[13:48] <alisonken1home> arfon: my abilitiy to write scripts does not include getting the server load over 500 :) those are customer installed plugins for things like wordpress
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[13:49] <shonudo> alisonken1home, do you allow users to up the load without any limits?
[13:49] <arfon> OH....  I'm glad you cleared that up, I was doubting my faith in your nerd-awesomeness
[13:49] <arfon> She like to live dangerously
[13:50] <alisonken1home> shonudo: if it starts affecting other customers - you'll get warned, then disabled
[13:50] <arfon> I'm surprised you didn't say Drupal
[13:50] <shonudo> makes sense
[13:50] <alisonken1home> arfon: I'm the "ken" part of alisonken1 :)
[13:50] <shonudo> so the limit is impact on usability
[13:51] <alisonken1home> correct - as long as we can catch a server before it hits 1K, there's a chance to find the culprit - otherwise we have to pull the plug on the server
[13:51] <arfon> Ok, then, ken, I'm glad you cleared that up, I was starting to doubt my belief in your nerd-awesonness
[13:51] <alisonken1home> dustybin: and that's why we use hardware raid
[13:51] Action: arfon likes cheese
[13:52] <shonudo> i remember setting up software raid arrays (promise software raid setups) -- an unstable nightmare
[13:52] <shonudo> poof... all gone
[13:52] <arfon> I still say, 3-ware is AWESOME
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[13:53] <rg3> hello
[13:53] <arfon> Hi rg
[13:53] <arfon> 3
[13:53] <shonudo> hola, rg3
[13:54] <rg3> when trying to add an acl entry to a directory in slackware64-current, i get the "operation not supported" error
[13:54] <shonudo> how are you "adding"?
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[13:55] <dustybin> alisonken1home: i can see your point now
[13:55] <arfon> 1 + 1 =4
[13:55] <rg3> i guess this means the filesystem driver in the kernel has been compiled without acl support, is this right for the slackware official kernels?
[13:55] <rg3> shonudo: setfacl -m u:USERNAME:rx DIRECTORY, for example
[13:55] <dustybin> what are adaptec RAID cards like?
[13:55] <arfon> As much as nerds LOVE ACLs, that would suprise me
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[13:56] <arfon> They have been around forever Dusty
[13:56] jgeboski_ (~jgeboski@97.72.86.194) joined ##slackware.
[13:56] <arfon> They were the standard at one time
[13:56] <alisonken1home> the only ones I have experience with are some older intel (6+ years old), LSI, 3-Ware, and Areca
[13:56] Nick change: jgeboski_ -> jgeboski
[13:56] Nick change: Guest88886 -> RaNdY
[13:56] <mishehu> blargh.  Atom PSE erratum detected, BIOS microcode update recommended  <-- how does one rectify this issue?  I updated the system bios to the most recent for my zotac ionitx-d motherboard.
[13:57] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest25840
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[13:58] <dustybin> RAID cards are not cheap at all, especially the ones what can do RAID-6
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[13:58] <dustybin> http://www.ebuyer.com/search?page=1&subcat=1277&q=RAID&mfr=576
[13:58] <arfon> i <3 RAID 5
[13:58] <arfon> Dusty, GOOD RAID cards are not cheap
[13:58] <dustybin> yep
[13:58] <dustybin> you get what you pay for
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[13:59] <arfon> 3-ware and RAID 5 saved my @$$ on atleast 3 occassions.
[14:00] <alisonken1home> 32-drive raid arrays saved us many times
[14:01] <mishehu> dustybin: areca's are pretty nice
[14:01] <arfon> Well, as I have said before...  YAY! It's lunch time!
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[14:01] <shonudo> heh
[14:01] <mishehu> dustybin: if $300 for a 4-port sata card isn't *too* much
[14:01] <rg3> oh, my mistake, they are supported but the mount option was not active
[14:02] <shonudo> rg3, nice problem solving
[14:02] <dustybin> how about i buy a 4-port sata card with a controller for each channel, then use soft RAID with it
[14:02] <panzer> and why would you want to do soemthing like that?
[14:02] <shonudo> rg3: you were kind of lost in the middle of a discussion about raid -- i was afraid it was going to take a while for you to get a response
[14:02] <rg3> shonudo: it usually comes just after asking the question in public =)
[14:02] <shonudo> indeed
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[14:04] <motaro> hello people
[14:04] <motaro> Question!
[14:04] <shonudo> ask away
[14:04] <alisonken1home> hola motaro
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[14:06] <shonudo> what's the question/problem, motaro?
[14:06] <motaro> A client of mine came to me and present me with the current situation: they receive quote orders by a sales email account to which every sales person in the company has access to.
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[14:07] <motaro> They want to implement a way in which if a sales persons takes the order first and responds to the client, it will let it know to the other salespersons in the team that the first sales person has taken ownership of the case.
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[14:08] <shonudo> responding salesperson could do that with a "cc"
[14:08] <motaro> Now I have never seen before the usage of email in this way.
[14:08] <shonudo> you want it automated?
[14:09] <motaro> I'm thinking how could I implement this without having to develop yet another application for them.
[14:09] <alisonken1home> we use an inhouse setup that puts email into a database, then a web front end that the ts'ers select to answer, so the next person that clicks on the message will see "Lock Detected" which indicates someone already has it
[14:09] <alisonken1home> not sure if there's one already out there
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[14:11] <motaro> Well from what you propose it will be kind of a smaill email client by itself.
[14:12] <shonudo> motaro, how would you like it to work (lay that out first so everyone has an idea of how to do it)?
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[14:12] <alisonken1home> the problem would be if 2 people select the same email within a minute (before the reply can get to the system)
[14:12] <panzer> alisonken1home: why do mail that way?
[14:13] <alisonken1home> panzer: we have tech support answering emails 24/7 that work in offices in 3 cities
[14:13] <shonudo> motaro, would you like the person who opens/answers the email to communicate to others that they have ownership?
[14:13] <shonudo> and to have that automatically happen?
[14:13] <alisonken1home> one of them in northern california, and 2 in southern california
[14:13] <motaro> Yes
[14:14] <motaro> Why mail. They have this fax system that practically that's what it does
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[14:14] <motaro> and want to implement the same functionality in emails, so they don't have to change the paradigm for the sales persons.
[14:15] <shonudo> so could the original email message be moved out of a "pool" and into a specific mailbox?
[14:15] <panzer> alisonken1home: got you.  makes a bit mroe sense.
[14:17] <adrien> I went in a computer shop which showcased a bunch of netbooks, the eee pcs looked nice and quite fast, I hadn't planned that though so I was "unequipped" for a comparison, plus I didn't have enough time but I may go again soon
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[14:18] <motaro> shonudo: I suppose one could do that. The thing is how to report to the other's that the order has already been reponded and signed.
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[14:20] <shonudo> maybe i'm not getting it, but couldn't the salesperson just flag it or attach his/her response to the original?
[14:21] <adrien> and next time, I'll take a slack usb key with me :P  (and steal the wifi password from the apple booth)
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[14:22] <shonudo> motaro: the above seems a better solution to me inasmuch as everyone (and the company itself) knows what is going on with the servicing of a client
[14:22] <shonudo> salesperson takes a hike, someone can pick it up
[14:22] <alisonken1home> shonudo: email is not instantaneous - the clients typically don't do constant comms and the mta's typically don't push - so if you have a group email, it's not always easy to sync the timing in case 2 people try to access the same email
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[14:23] <shonudo> ah, didn't think of that; if enough people are responding at the same time, it could be a problem
[14:23] <alisonken1home> so by using a central database with a web front end, the ts'ers can keep track of what  has not been answered yet, as well as be able to pass to another ts'er in case they other guy has a better response
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[14:24] <motaro> Right now to me it seems that best answer is develop some plugin for an email client.
[14:25] <motaro> That will do the functionality
[14:25] <panzer> motaro: for alisonken1home that would not work.  still not instant.
[14:25] <alisonken1home> modify a currently working webmail client
[14:25] <panzer> that might work though.
[14:26] <alisonken1home> by using a webmail client - you don't have to worry if they use MS, Apple, Linux, BSD, etc..
[14:27] <alisonken1home> so the client would be free to implement that
[14:28] <motaro> Ok guys thanks, sounds good.
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[14:36] <sahko> http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/FreeType-2-4-now-free-from-patent-restrictions-1039730.html
[14:36] <adrien> bleh
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[14:43] <arfon> Howdy
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[15:09] <arfon> Panzer, you still on?
[15:10] <panzer> y
[15:10] <arfon> Do you have a moment to chat about IMAP?
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[15:12] <panzer> eating
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[15:12] <arfon> Noted
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[15:14] <ananke> what's there to chat about imap? use it :)
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[15:14] <chopp> and alpine is quite simple to setup really.
[15:15] <arfon> Im a POP guy....  never used IMAP
[15:15] <arfon> but, I may need to.
[15:15] <arfon> With IMAP, the mail is kept on the server right?
[15:15] <alisonken1home> the only real difference betwee pop and imap is that imap keeps the messages and folders on the server
[15:15] <ananke> arfon: yes
[15:16] <alisonken1home> so even a thin client with hardly any disk space can hook up to an imap mailbox with 50M+ folders
[15:16] <ananke> and the fact that imap provides folders
[15:16] <alisonken1home> so you don't have to worry about keeping a desktop and a laptop synced with the pop server
[15:16] <arfon> So, does the local client just download haeders?
[15:16] <arfon> headers?
[15:16] <alisonken1home> headers and the current message you're viewing
[15:17] <ananke> arfon: not even that, it can just request a list of messages
[15:17] <arfon> So, you can connect to an IMAP server, get a message list and see that offline but to get the actual message you haveto go online?
[15:18] <alisonken1home> imap is more online than offline - that's the other difference
[15:18] <ananke> arfon: there is an idea of off-line imap, but generally speaking it's meant for on-line operations
[15:18] <arfon> What I really want to know is, can you set an IMAP client to view a message but not download attachments (even inline attachments)?
[15:19] <alisonken1home> arfon: that's a client option - have to check with the client you want to use
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[15:19] <arfon> Is it a IMAP function?
[15:19] <arfon> Does IMAP support it?
[15:19] <ananke> arfon: most clients download only the bare minimum and what's requested.
[15:19] <ananke> yes
[15:19] <arfon> Nice....
[15:19] <alisonken1home> it's a clent option - and imap downloads what you ask it to download
[15:20] <arfon> Ihate to leave good 'ol POP but, I might have to...
[15:20] <arfon> So Postfix + Courier IMAP = win?
[15:21] <ananke> arfon: depends on your needs
[15:21] <arfon> My needs are VERY basic
[15:21] <ananke> if all you have is one person, i'd say not having your own e-mail is even better
[15:21] <ananke> s/person/account
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[15:21] <arfon> I have MANY accounts
[15:22] <arfon> ...and several computers that I need to access them from.
[15:22] <ananke> with capital M. yes, that tells me how many it really is
[15:22] <ananke> 2? 5? 10? 50? 500?
[15:22] <arfon> Capital "ANY" also
[15:22] <arfon> {infinity sign]
[15:22] <ananke> which is what?
[15:22] <arfon> Lots of catchalls.  :)
[15:23] <arfon> (JK)
[15:23] Action: ananke wouldn't consider somebody who manages lots of e-mail accounts to not know what imap is
[15:23] <arfon> I have about 10 accounts but, I want to provide accounts to family/friends
[15:23] <arfon> I don't manage them, most are hosted by my registrars
[15:24] <ananke> gmail would be easier
[15:24] <arfon> (which is one of the reasons I wanna move, 10Mb boxes sux)
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[15:24] <arfon> Yeah but, gmail can't host arfon@ArfonIsAwesome.com
[15:25] <ananke> sure it can
[15:25] <FriedBob> We are actually considering switchign to gmail at work, and dropping our internal mail server. We have a thousand or so domains we provide email for at present.
[15:25] <ananke> FriedBob: yeah, lots of big places use gmail for that. our alumni e-mail just moved to them
[15:25] <arfon> Gmail hosts mail for domains?
[15:25] <ananke> arfon: uhmm, yes
[15:25] <arfon> For free?
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[15:26] <raela> arfon: mail.google.com/a/other.host
[15:26] <FriedBob> ananke: My wife's school uses it for their email as well.
[15:26] <raela> arfon: my school email is through gmail
[15:26] <sahko> the pita is that even if you get paid accounts from google, you still get clipped messages and stuff. paid is exactly the same as free. if i am not mistakin
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[15:26] <thumbs> why would they provide that service for free?
[15:27] <arfon> Backup...  Gmail will host MANY email accounts for various domains for free?
[15:27] <dustybin> how interesting
[15:27] <dustybin> http://www.returninfinity.com/baremetal.html
[15:27] <dustybin> 'The OS is written entirely in Assembly'
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[15:27] <dustybin> does that mean ULTRA FAST ?
[15:28] <ananke> dustybin: no, it means it's written in assembly
[15:28] <alisonken1home> http://paulstamatiou.com/how-to-setup-gmail-for-hosted-domains/
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[15:28] <arfon> Not if the assembly is poorly written
[15:28] <dustybin> ok
[15:28] <arfon> Thanks Ken
[15:28] <raela> dustybin: it means it might get a virus. watch out
[15:28] <dustybin> eeeek
[15:29] <alisonken1home> I don't think gmail is free for companies
[15:29] <alisonken1home> need to check with the gmail terms of service
[15:29] <alisonken1home> http://www.google.com/apps/intl/en/business/gmail.html#utm_campaign=en&utm_source=en-ha-na-us-sk&utm_medium=ha&utm_term=email%20hosting
[15:29] <WireWulf> assembly been awail sents i have seen a os writen in that
[15:29] <arfon> Do you remember when the Arachne guys were writing their own OS in assembler?
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[15:30] <arfon> Real men write in Machine Code
[15:30] <shonudo> lol
[15:30] <raela> binary
[15:30] <shonudo> there you go
[15:30] <arfon> 00 AF 6F 6F 10
[15:30] <raela> wait, this is an xkcd comic.. let's stop here ;/
[15:30] <dustybin> are us humans clever enough to program a computer to its full potential?
[15:30] <arfon> Dusty, Yes, that's why we have Windows Vista
[15:31] <shonudo> well, it's "we humans"... so maybe not
[15:31] <dustybin> LOL
[15:31] <shonudo> lol@arfon
[15:31] <arfon> wut?
[15:31] <shonudo> the vista thing
[15:31] <arfon> oh yeah....  :)
[15:31] <shonudo> seems MS may live that down after all
[15:31] <shonudo> no one used it
[15:32] <arfon> No ME was BY FAR the worst version
[15:32] <shonudo> yeah, because tons of people were conned into using it
[15:32] <shonudo> ME was a disaster
[15:33] <arfon> I think you are thinking of IE/Outpuke
[15:33] <arfon> I mean, IE=You can browse for viruses
[15:33] <ananke> oddly enough, outlook is used by a large chunk of the business world
[15:33] <arfon> Outpuke=2G autocorrupt feature
[15:33] <shonudo> it is that
[15:33] <ananke> so claiming it's a disaster is a bit of a stretch
[15:34] <alisonken1home> claiming it's a disater is benig nice :)
[15:34] <shonudo> outlook was/is actually one of MS's "successes"
[15:34] <shonudo> not that that says much
[15:34] <arfon> Not really, for YEARS I had to deal with people who's PST file corrupted becuase they got to be 2G.  The worst were the bosses.
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[15:35] <ananke> arfon: yet that didn't stop outlook from becoming essential tool in lots of businesses
[15:35] <arfon> Then the Fricken PST repair tool never worked
[15:35] <admboom> lol, pst hell
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[15:35] <admboom> as an exchange admin i banned the use of pst's
[15:35] <ananke> so i guess definition of a 'disaster' would need to be specified :)
[15:35] <arfon> Yes, and VHS and C-Quam won also
[15:36] <arfon> Disaster=Your bos loses all of his mail, attachments, contracts and etc. because Outlook corrupted his PST file.
[15:36] <ananke> arfon: you know, outlook is more than an e-mail client :) its main benefit is in being used with exchange
[15:37] <ananke> where of course, your scenario wouldn't be an issue
[15:37] <arfon> ...and now YOU HAVE TO FIX IT FOR HIM.  Because, it must be your fault since Microsoft would NEVER realse a program that would do that!
[15:37] <ananke> see pop3 vs imap :)
[15:37] <ananke> arfon: what were you doing using pop3? :)
[15:37] <sahko> hah
[15:38] <arfon> Yes, Outpuke does more...   WHY DO I WANT AN ADDRESS BOOK IN MY E_MAIL PROGRAM!?!?!
[15:38] <dustybin> powertop is a interesting application
[15:38] <ananke> seriously. if data is important, it gets backed up. if you run a mail system, you have a central location for it, and you back it up
[15:38] <arfon> i <3 POP
[15:38] <ananke> arfon: because you're not working in the business world
[15:38] <ananke> contacts, calendaring and e-mail are used as one tool.
[15:38] <arfon> Not in my world
[15:39] <ananke> in fact, why wouldn't you want an address book to be integrated with your e-mail client?
[15:39] <arfon> The only think I want in my e-mauil client is e-mails and e-mail addresses
[15:39] <ananke> arfon: well, you represent a minority in the business world. vast chunk of it feels the opposite
[15:40] <sahko> email addresses == address book
[15:40] <arfon> Why would I want an address book in my e-mail client????  If I'm writing an e-mail, I certainly don't need the person's phone number or snail-mail address.
[15:40] <alisonken1home> arfon: it's an analogy :)
[15:40] <arfon> If I'm going to call someone, I probably won't shoot them an e-mail telling them what I called about...
[15:41] <ananke> arfon: i think it's fair to say that your view is very limited, and it seems that you're unwilling to gain a better perspective
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[15:41] <shonudo> what's wrong with organizing information -- wanting to contact someone and having all the contact information in one place seems useful
[15:42] <ananke> arfon: outlook/exchange allows you to have a uniform means and methods of communicating with people, and arrange meetings
[15:42] <arfon> You didn't answer my question...  Why would I want an address book in my e-mail client?
[15:42] <ananke> arfon: and why would you want to have a separate address book?
[15:42] <sahko> cause an address book doesnt only have street addresses, but email addresses too
[15:42] <sahko> do you memorize all email addresses?
[15:43] <alisonken1home> arfon: the idea is you don't have similar/associated information in multiple places - especially if you're not in the same building as your address book, you can still access the information
[15:43] <ananke> just because in your e-mail communication all you rely on is e-mail addresses, it doesn't mean that people do not need to have address books. that's what outlook provides.
[15:43] <arfon> No, I keep them in an address book (actually a wiki)
[15:43] <ananke> arfon: ohh, so you need another product, which doesn't even integrate with your e-mail system
[15:43] <arfon> Tiddlywiki to be exact :)
[15:43] <ananke> so when you want to e-mail somebody, you better remember their e-mail address, or have it duplicated in your e-mail client
[15:43] <nachox> you keep your email address in a wiki?
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[15:44] <arfon> Yes, but when I open TiddlyWiki, my system doesn't crawl to a halt while trying to open a 1.5G PST file.
[15:44] <nachox> that's a bit... unpractical
[15:44] <arfon> How so?
[15:44] <ananke> here's an example: with an iphone and username/password i connect to my exchange equivalent [zimbra]. my address book from zimbra is clearly integrated with the phone functionality
[15:44] <alisonken1home> then don't use outlook
[15:44] <alisonken1home> use somethng that works - and imap is good for that as well
[15:44] <arfon>   I happliy don't
[15:45] <sahko> so pop + outlook + tiddlywiki == win? :p
[15:45] <arfon> Since I left the corporate world, I have been happliy Outpuke free (except for a few friends that still call me for support)
[15:46] <arfon> NO Sahko...  POP + Eudora + Wiki = win!
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[15:47] <arfon> Unfortunately, the new Thunderbird versions of Eudora has News integrated...  :(   WHY DO I WANT A NEWS READER IN MY E-MAIL CLIENT!?!?!
[15:47] Nick change: StarX -> Stars
[15:47] <arfon> My life is hard
[15:47] <nachox> having the address book and even the calendar integrated is a great feature, you plan meetings and you get task assigned through mail
[15:47] <alisonken1home> actually, newsfeeds and email are very similar :)
[15:48] <arfon> Yes, Sewage and Fresh Water are simular but, I don't want them mixed....
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[15:48] Action: ananke accepts another meeting on his outlook equivalent...
[15:49] <arfon> I'm just going to write a big bash script to telnet my mail to me :)
[15:49] <ananke> arfon: your abuse of caps and multiple question marks baffles me
[15:49] <arfon> It how I emote
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[15:49] <arfon> it is
[15:49] <ananke> nachox: bingo. all in one place, available from any compatible client
[15:50] <nachox> usage says it all. people adopted the integrated client because it made them more productive
[15:50] <arfon> ? = question     ???=wtf
[15:50] <nachox> the same thing happened with windows, and windows and active directory. despite all its security shortcommings, windows made people more productive
[15:50] <arfon> !?!?!?= WTF!
[15:51] <alisonken1home> actually, it's more like beer v. wine
[15:51] <arfon> I dispute that Nachox....  PowerPoint
[15:51] <ananke> arfon: if you want to work in this industry for longer, you may want to accept some standards :)
[15:52] <ananke> powerpoint is another industry standard. i can't think of any other tool prior to it, which had the same impact on presentations
[15:52] <Skywise> i do, it was called slide shows
[15:52] <arfon> I can't think of any other application that has caused so many wasted man-hours.
[15:53] <nachox> arfon, managers dont often have time to read lengthy word documents, powerpoint and presentations in general make you have to summarize stuff. A presentation longer than 17 slides is too long for todays standards
[15:53] <alisonken1home> actually, I belive powerpoint was a ripoff of something else (besides slide shows), but MS made it popular
[15:53] <ananke> arfon: wasted on what exactly? preperation of presentations?
[15:53] <Skywise> they used to use overhead projectors
[15:53] <ananke> powerpoint is quite easy to use
[15:54] <ananke> Skywise: indeed, although i was mostly targetting the computing era
[15:55] <ananke> arfon: in all seriousness, when an organization reaches roughly 50+ employees, things are done on a different scale. what may not make much sense to you as an individual, makes perfect business sense with larger population
[15:56] <ananke> interestingly enough, we print about 50 powerpoint posters a month, on large format printer
[15:56] <dustybin> wow
[15:56] <dustybin> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2311h.htm
[15:57] <arfon> Ananke, Most of my working life, I have worked at 50+ corporations...  There's nothing you can tell me about corporate life that I haven't experienced.
[15:57] <ananke> arfon: you obviously haven't experienced imap :)
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[15:57] <ananke> dustybin: dell has been making those for some time :)
[15:57] <arfon> No, because We've mostly used POP  :)
[15:57] <Skywise> every presentation manifested on paper that no one will even bother to look at again
[15:58] <dustybin> ananke: im going to order one
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[15:58] <Skywise> we used to make slides up in corel draw
[15:58] <ananke> arfon: which makes sense on a smaller immobile scale, where people have stationary and single computers. in this day and age pop3 has too many shortcomings
[15:58] <alisonken1home> I prefer imap since I have about 4 computers that I use between home and work - I don't have to sync between them and try to remember if I answered an email or not
[15:58] Nick change: Guest37790 -> RaNdY
[15:58] <Skywise> i like webmail and imap
[15:59] <Skywise> that way, i'm only using 1 account and don't have to worry about local copies or things being out of sync
[15:59] <arfon> That's why I'm looking at IMAP.
[15:59] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest50897
[15:59] <arfon> Webmail SUX on lynx
[15:59] <ananke> yeah, between your desktop, laptop, smart phone and random web location - pop3 just falls short
[15:59] <Skywise> what application are you talking about?
[15:59] <ananke> aha, time for a meeting
[15:59] <Skywise> i use horde
[15:59] <arfon> For years, Leave Mail On Server has been a good friend
[16:00] <ananke> arfon: leave mail on server is a nasty hack in comparison to what imap provides
[16:00] <dustybin> how many monitors have you used where you can get a result like this when the screen is black:
[16:00] <dustybin> http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/images/dell_u2311h/uniformity_black.jpg
[16:00] <dustybin> in a dark room
[16:00] <nachox> ananke, the worse enemy of imap are too small mail account storage space :P
[16:00] <ananke> aha, my e-mail client notified me that i have a meeting in 3 minutes. what a travesty :)
[16:01] <arfon> I agree, the problem with IMAP is people hosting your account get pissed when you fill up your box
[16:01] <Skywise> i use cyrus for storing email
[16:02] <Skywise> its nice cause you don't have to make accounts in the os for the mailbox
[16:02] <Skywise> and you can also have multiple domains all segregated
[16:02] <arfon> I know nothing about cyrus
[16:03] <Skywise> cyrus is flexible, so that means its complex
[16:03] <Skywise> but its been very reliable for me
[16:03] <arfon> So, how do you arechive old mail with IMAP?
[16:04] <Skywise> just copy folders around
[16:04] <alisonken1home> move it to an archive folder you designate
[16:05] <arfon> What if it's a corporate server and there are no archive folders?
[16:05] <alisonken1home> arfon: the folders are created by the client - they just reside on the server
[16:05] <Skywise> what do you do noow
[16:06] <arfon> I POP it so, I have it on my local machine and don't worry about filling up my e-mail quota
[16:06] <alisonken1home> the only thing that you have to figure out is filters to move to the folders - you can use a procmail filter on the server, or copy a filter in each client
[16:07] <Skywise> you can copy email locally with imap, you just don't have to
[16:07] <alisonken1home> you can also forward your emails to a pop client you can archive
[16:08] <arfon> Let me re-ask...  Let's say you have a 200MB e-mail quota...  Your IMAP boxes are at 199.9MB... How do you archive old messages to free up space?
[16:08] <Skywise> one of the advantages with imap is you can basically download headers without getting the body
[16:08] <arfon> ...and you don't controll the box.
[16:08] <alisonken1home> arfon: forward to your own archiver email server
[16:08] <Skywise> i don't, emails will bounce like they should
[16:08] <alisonken1home> or redirect rather than forward
[16:08] <Skywise> the users must maintain their boxes
[16:09] <arfon> Won't that mark all of the messages with FWD:  ?
[16:09] <alisonken1home> not if you redirect - it will just give it a redirect header
[16:09] <arfon> So, IMAP does not contain an "Archive to Locakl Machine" system?
[16:10] <alisonken1home> depends on teh client
[16:10] <arfon> (just curious)
[16:10] <Skywise> thats all in the client
[16:10] <Skywise> you can download and remove the mail from the server or you can download and leave it there
[16:10] <arfon> Ah
[16:10] <arfon> Nice
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[16:11] <arfon> Okay, next subject: mbox vs Maildir?
[16:11] <alisonken1home> maildir
[16:11] <arfon> (I tend to agree with you)
[16:11] <alisonken1home> mbox has a problem when it gets too big
[16:11] <alisonken1home> as  long as you have enough inodes, maildir
[16:12] <arfon> Why is mbox so popular then?
[16:12] <Skywise> because it works by default
[16:12] <alisonken1home> mbox is well understood and only requires one file+index - but it suffers if you have too many emails in it - plus you can't easily segregate the email into groups
[16:12] <alisonken1home> mbox is the original email format
[16:14] <arfon> Okay, next subject: Soda or Pop?
[16:14] <alisonken1home> maildir format didn't come until many-many years later
[16:14] <alisonken1home> same difference :)
[16:14] <Skywise> sodapop
[16:14] <arfon> You're a tricky one
[16:14] <alisonken1home> soda and pop are generic terms for the same thing
[16:15] <arfon> Maildir just seems to make more sense
[16:15] <Skywise> eastern pa says soda, western says pop
[16:15] <arfon> Supposedly in the South, Pop is what is said but, everyone I know always say Soda.
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[16:16] <arfon> ...for the same thing: Coke
[16:16] <Skywise> i would suspect most of the people in the south on the internet came from somewhere else
[16:16] <alisonken1home> Coke is a registered trademark - just like Pepsi :)
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[16:16] <arfon> They can kiss my grits....  I's saying Coke
[16:17] <arfon> And I say Kleenex
[16:17] <Skywise> i say cola
[16:17] <arfon> ..And I'll sing Happy Birthday any time I want!
[16:17] <NyteOwl> mmm Beer
[16:17] <Skywise> tomato tomahto
[16:17] <arfon> Happy Birthday = Beer?
[16:18] <arfon> Let's call the whole thing off.
[16:19] <trhodes> "phosphate" is an obscure one
[16:19] <arfon> Wut?
[16:20] <alisonken1home> Willie Peter
[16:20] <Skywise> i think he meant aluminum
[16:20] <trhodes> for soda/pop/coke/cola/carbonated beverage
[16:20] <arfon> Al-u-min-i-um?
[16:20] <alisonken1home> Skywise: nope - phosphate is used as a preservative/bubble maker
[16:20] <arfon> I use it to clean things
[16:21] <Skywise> they used to have different names for everything
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[16:23] <Skywise> man, i wanted to work on my car today, but its gonna be 97 and i can't get it into my living room
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[16:23] <arfon> I feel your pain, Sky
[16:23] <arfon> It's hard to get motivated to do stuff outdoors during summer.
[16:23] <Skywise> its 97' already
[16:23] <Skywise> yeah
[16:23] <Skywise> and it doesn't cool off at night
[16:24] <arfon> You in Texas Sky?
[16:24] <Skywise> i've been getting up at like 4am and its still too hot
[16:24] <Skywise> nope a lot further north, in maryland
[16:24] <arfon> LOL!  Get some Texas summer up there!
[16:25] <Skywise> we can do hot and swampy just fine
[16:25] <arfon> I'm so tired of the heat, someone should turn down the sun a little
[16:25] <Skywise> hopefully we'll get some rain today
[16:25] <arfon> YAY Humidity
[16:26] <Skywise> its already 65%
[16:26] <arfon> I HATE the sun and heat, so I moved to Texas  :P
[16:26] <Skywise> yeah, how'd that work out
[16:26] <arfon> Kinda like working on Outpuke problems....
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[16:28] <Skywise> i have to say i didn't like texas when i went there
[16:28] <Skywise> it was always too hot
[16:29] <arfon> It took me a little while to get used to but now, I'm liking it.
[16:29] <Skywise> walking around houston like a vole sucked
[16:29] <arfon> No, there's 3weeks in winter where it gets cold....
[16:29] <arfon> THAT was your problem.. Houston sux
[16:29] <Skywise> maybe i'll come down then
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[16:30] <arfon> DON'T go to Houston, San Antonio or....  Yeah, don't go there.
[16:30] <Skywise> so whats the good part of texas? mexico?
[16:31] <arfon> Good part of Texas is everywhere BUT Houston and San Antonio and all of the border towns
[16:32] <arfon> West Texas is open and beautiful
[16:32] <arfon> East Texas is full of trees and beautiful
[16:32] <Skywise> you might wanna clear that off your screen before someone looks over your shoulder and shoots your monitor
[16:32] <arfon> PFFT!
[16:32] <Skywise> west texas is a wasteland
[16:32] <arfon> Guns aren't allowed in the work place
[16:32] <Skywise> i've been thru there
[16:33] <Skywise> the only place thats got less to look at then west texas is kansas
[16:33] <arfon> :)
[16:33] <arfon> You must not like open land, rock formations and windmills...
[16:33] <Skywise> no, i like stuff and trees
[16:33] <trhodes> kansas is bad from the interstates
[16:33] <Skywise> kansas screws with your minds
[16:34] <rob0> except I-35 between Wichita and Emporia, that part is scenic
[16:34] <duet> i live 30 minutes from houston and i also try to never go there
[16:34] <trhodes> yeah
[16:34] <Skywise> you see a tree and then take a nap and 2hrs later you can still see the same tree
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[16:34] <trhodes> I-70 in the west part of kansas is pretty desolate
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[16:35] <rob0> but I-70 between Topeka and Junction City has some nice spots too
[16:35] <Skywise> parts of kansas could be mistaken for the moon
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[16:36] <rob0> I lived about 1/3rd of my life in Kansas, and came to it with the negative impressions, but found it wasn't so bad.
[16:36] <Skywise> i bet you could close your eyes and drive off in any direction and not hit anything in kansas
[16:36] <Skywise> for hours
[16:37] <duet> but if it werent for houston i would not have a 4g broadband connection to the internet
[16:37] <rob0> western Nebraska, that's worse than western Kansas
[16:37] <Skywise> the only between nebraska and the north pole is a fence and that blew down
[16:37] <Skywise> the only thing...
[16:38] <Skywise> kansas is dustier then nebraska tho
[16:38] <rob0> yeah, now South Dakota turns amazingly cool at the badlands and on west, but the east part is not so nice
[16:39] <Skywise> you can always tell if someone is from kansas cause if you slap them on the back dust flies off, even years later
[16:39] <rob0> no, w. nebraska is dry and windswept, Kansas beats it hands down
[16:39] <rob0> 'cept for one thing
[16:39] <duet> http://www.theonion.com/articles/apple-claims-new-iphone-only-visible-to-most-loyal,2772/
[16:39] <rob0> haha, I cruised through Nebraska on some back roads once at some very high speeds :)
[16:40] <rob0> you can see for 10 miles, you can see further than a cop's radar, even if there WAS a cop
[16:40] <Skywise> i wanted to drive thru montana with no speed limit but then i thought i'd still be in montana
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[16:41] <arfon> Stupid work....  keeps interupting my chatting.
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[16:41] <Skywise> i do wanna ride a train thru the rockies someday
[16:42] <Skywise> its really hard to believe people walked across those
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[16:42] <Skywise> i guess its a good thing they didn't know what they were in for before they started
[16:42] <NyteOwl> travelling parts of the midwest US and the Candaian praries can get boring after a while.
[16:43] <Skywise> they're boring even to fly over
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[16:43] <NyteOwl> seemingly  endless  horizon
[16:44] <Skywise> yeah, its wild how long it takes to fly over at 500mph
[16:44] <arfon> HA!  The mighthave said: "Hey Bill, are you ready to walk across the Rockies tody?  Nah, Ted, that's too much work, let's just sit here and drink beer instead".
[16:44] <Skywise> i think thats how denver was founded
[16:44] <arfon> [cue Nyteowl]
[16:45] <arfon> They got to the mountain and was too tired to cross so they created Denver?
[16:45] rirombo (~rirombo@h165.58.91.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) joined ##slackware.
[16:46] <Skywise> more or less
[16:47] <arfon> Speaking of Denver, How did Mork from Ork get from Milawaulkie in the 50's to Denver in the 70's????   Hmmm
[16:47] <Skywise> a very slow space ship
[16:47] <arfon> I think it would have been a very FAST space ship...  you know, the faster you go, the slower time is for you.
[16:47] <Skywise> there ya go
[16:48] <Skywise> he went so fast it took 20 years
[16:48] <arfon> Things that make you go Hmmm.
[16:48] <Skywise> i just think it means god didn't think everything out when he made the universe
[16:49] <arfon> (I think it means that Script Writers are dumb)
[16:49] <arfon> (or television audiences are)
[16:49] <Skywise> even now he's saying, do i have to think of everything
[16:49] <arfon> Speaking of which, who was let down by last night's Futurama?
[16:50] <arfon> [raises hand]
[16:50] <Skywise> i didn't see it
[16:50] <Skywise> i haven't see any of the new ones yet
[16:50] <arfon> Let me have your Nerdcard
[16:50] <Skywise> i lost it long ago
[16:51] <Skywise> i like scifi but not syfi
[16:51] <arfon> [insert ned/girlfriend joke]
[16:51] <arfon> ned=nerd
[16:51] <Skywise> i think star trek is lame hollywood syfi
[16:51] <arfon> what is syfi?
[16:51] <arfon> Not TOS
[16:52] <Skywise> its what the sci-fi channel now calls itself as an updated abbreviation
[16:52] <Skywise> cause they're cool
[16:52] <arfon> Syfi channel blows
[16:52] <FriedBob> syfi looks too much like syphillus to me.
[16:52] <Skywise> i like sci fi from books
[16:53] <arfon> I'm so tired of crap Dragon Slayer type movies and crap Scifi movies on there, I can't stand it
[16:53] <shonudo> i like sci fi from outer space
[16:53] <Skywise> lol
[16:53] <Skywise> cgi has ruined movies
[16:53] <arfon> What have you seen from outer space Shonudo?
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[16:54] <arfon> No, poor writers who just slap out crap ruined movies
[16:54] <Skywise> i've seen the static from the big bang,  but it wasn't every entertaining
[16:54] <arfon> cgi=win
[16:54] <shonudo> UFOs, arfon... i'm in NM
[16:54] <shonudo> happens all the time
[16:54] <shonudo> lol
[16:54] <arfon> Nice
[16:54] <shonudo> joke
[16:54] <arfon> Go find me Bender's head plaese
[16:54] <arfon> It's buried out near Roswell
[16:54] <shonudo> have to wait 1000 years
[16:54] <Skywise> he should be there by now
[16:54] <arfon> :(
[16:54] <shonudo> you saw the episode
[16:55] <arfon> I'll be too old to enjoy it
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[16:55] <Skywise> but if you find him, he's just gonna steal your wallet
[16:55] <Skywise> so let someone else find him
[16:55] <shonudo> yeah, even with just his head
[16:55] <shonudo> thieving bastard
[16:55] <arfon> Ah
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[16:56] <dustybin> do you guys remember the type of people who play RPG games, like Dungeons & Dragons
[16:56] <arfon> Wait! I'll give you $5 not to do what youre thinking of doing.... HA HA HA, you just lost $5!
[16:56] <Skywise> i used to play that
[16:56] <shonudo> dustybin, yea
[16:56] Action: arfon points at Skywise
[16:56] <dustybin> do they still exist?
[16:56] <Skywise> i think so
[16:56] Action: arfon points at Skywise
[16:56] <Skywise> i don't play it anymore
[16:56] <shonudo> a lot of anachronistic society whatevers around, so yeah
[16:56] <dustybin> i remember some peple used to spend HOURS painting figures
[16:57] Action: arfon points at Skywise
[16:57] <Skywise> thats a little slow
[16:57] <arfon> :)
[16:57] <Skywise> nah, i could paint them pretty quicly
[16:57] <shonudo> make fun of D&D all you want, but it served as the basis for a whole generation of games
[16:57] <Skywise> you just needed an #00000 brush
[16:57] <arfon> That's one hair right?
[16:57] <Skywise> the problem i had with d&d was when it started getting too technical
[16:58] <Skywise> practically
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[16:58] <shonudo> and i'd say the WoW bunch is more over the edge anyway
[16:58] <arfon> Hey, my Ret Pally can kick your Chaotic-evil mage!
[16:58] <Skywise> yeah, and then you got people who wanted to play real life d&d in caves and they all lost the point
[16:58] <Skywise> it was really just about having an ad hoc adventure
[16:59] <shonudo> yup
[16:59] <arfon> lost the point or 'got lost'?
[16:59] <shonudo> sort of lost the point, it seems
[16:59] <Skywise> yeah
[16:59] <dustybin> wargames
[16:59] <Skywise> and re-enacting
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[17:00] <Skywise> so, i liked playing on muds and such, but never got into 2nd life or whatever
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[17:01] <shonudo> i think the point is "playing"... if it becomes more than that, there's probably something else at work
[17:01] <arfon> Muds and those text games were always so tediuo to me
[17:01] <arfon> tediuos
[17:01] <Skywise> yeah, i think grinding thru levels sucks
[17:01] <arfon> tedious
[17:01] <arfon> "use key"
[17:01] <shonudo> three's a charm
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[17:01] <Skywise> the people i played with made if fun
[17:02] <arfon> How can "use key" be made fun????
[17:02] <Skywise> as we'd try to explore and discover new parts of the map and survive
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[17:02] <Skywise> no, you're thinking of text games like adventure
[17:02] <arfon> "you're in a long coridor. It extends 50 feet with a door.>?"
[17:03] <Skywise> muds are text based, but multiplayer
[17:03] <Skywise> and you can have roaming and fixed monsters
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[17:04] <arfon> Here's how I played: "/quit   cd /rrd   railroadtycoon.exe"
[17:04] <phrag> everything goes dark... you are eaten by a grue
[17:04] <arfon> IGrues sux
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[17:05] <arfon> IGrues = Greus
[17:05] <arfon> Damnit
[17:05] <Skywise> i always wanted to catch a grue
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[17:05] <arfon> Where would you keep it if you did?
[17:06] <arfon> (Grue is Zork?)
[17:06] <Skywise> yeah
[17:07] <arfon> Hard to remember that stuff
[17:07] <Skywise> i'd keep in the houses of people i didn't like
[17:07] Action: arfon locks his door
[17:09] <Skywise> brb
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[17:11] <arfon> (he's getting his grue)
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[17:13] stillborn kicked from ##slackware by slackboy: Banned: spammers
[17:13] Nick change: WireWulf -> Wulf-is-not-here
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[17:14] Action: BP{k} is now known as do-not-care-where-the-heck-wulf-is
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[17:15] Nick change: arfon -> Wulf-who
[17:15] <Wulf-who> ?
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[17:15] Nick change: Wulf-who -> arfon
[17:15] <raela> BP{k}: ...does? :) *ducks*
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[17:18] <adrien> arfon: it meant: no need to change nicks when you're going away
[17:18] <arfon> I know but, I'm bored...
[17:19] <arfon> 43 more minutes until the weekend
[17:19] <arfon> This is the longest part of the week
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[17:19] Action: dustybin steals arfon 3ware RAID card
[17:20] <arfon> Aww, Dusty, I WISH I had a 3-ware card  :(
[17:20] <dustybin> for home use its overkill..
[17:20] <arfon> Never had $250 extra in my accounts to buy one for myself.
[17:22] <arfon> Hey, if it's worth doing, overkill it!
[17:22] <FriedBob> I can think of better thigns to do with $250.
[17:22] <phrag> merg
[17:22] <FriedBob> Like 1-2 boxes of cigars.
[17:22] <arfon> Cheap hookers are NOT a better use of the $$$$
[17:22] <dustybin> 1-2 hard drives
[17:23] <FriedBob> 1 good bottle of scotch.
[17:23] <arfon> FriedBob, Swisher Sweets...  You can get about 50 boxes of those
[17:23] <FriedBob> arfon: I don't smoke trash.
[17:23] <arfon> You know you wat a box of Watermelon Swishers
[17:24] <FriedBob> No, but I'd love abox of Camacho Corojo Diplomas, or CAO La Traveiatias.
[17:24] <stillborn> good night people, has anyone tried packaging irssi-xmpp-0.51 ?
[17:24] <arfon> Wut?
[17:24] <arfon> Not me
[17:25] <phrag> 250 cups of coffee... caffiene time!
[17:25] <dustybin> FriedBob: do you drink malt
[17:25] <arfon> I don't know about Camacho but, the University of Phoenix will sell you as many diplomas as you want.
[17:26] <phrag> stillborn: not that i know of, but that sounds interesting
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[17:30] <FriedBob> dustybin: Malt licquor or single malt whiskey?
[17:31] <dustybin> either!
[17:31] <dustybin> 'The first Slackware release, 1.00, was on July 16, 1993'
[17:31] <dustybin> Fri Jul 16 22:28:36 BST 2010
[17:31] <dustybin> Happy Birthday Slackware :D
[17:31] <FriedBob> dustybin: yes, but not malt licquor often. rarely, actually.
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[17:31] <dustybin> aye ok!
[17:32] <arfon> It's not 22:28 yet
[17:32] <dustybin> it is here in UK
[17:32] <arfon> Happy Birthday Slackware!
[17:33] <arfon> In 2003, I had a "Happy 10th Slackware" cake made and we at it at the office.
[17:33] <arfon> I posted the pictures on LinuxPackages forums
[17:33] <arfon> picture
[17:35] <BP{k}> http://www.slackware.com/announce/1.0.php <-- slighty different timestamp there ;)
[17:35] <arfon> He's in the UK, time runs 'differently' there
[17:36] <BP{k}> uhm ...
[17:36] <raela> BP{k} is from the UK
[17:36] <BP{k}> 17:21 PST != 22:228 BST
[17:36] Nick change: BiCHiTo -> Sauron|Out
[17:36] <arfon> No, you have to conver it to milimeters
[17:36] <arfon> Then it matches
[17:36] <BP{k}> ...
[17:37] <FriedBob> arfon: So, what is the current time where you are? In mm
[17:37] <arfon> 27 feet
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[17:41] <adrien> actually, it was already =)     "23:29         arfon : It's not 22:28 yet"     (not speaking of the "23")
[17:41] <arfon> Happy Belated Birthday then?
[17:42] <bitlord> is it today?
[17:43] <BP{k}> bitlord: yes, give or take about three hours.
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[17:44] <bitlord> here 23:44
[17:45] <bitlord> Happy Birthday Slackware
[17:45] <arfon> Good lord, 17
[17:46] <arfon> Take that Ubuntu!
[17:46] <bitlord> what?
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[17:46] <arfon> 4 more years and Slackware can drink beer
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[17:47] <bitlord> LOL, in which country? here with 18
[17:47] <arfon> US
[17:48] <arfon> actually in Texas, you can legally drink even younger IF your parent okays it.
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[17:49] <Xgates> hey guys
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[17:50] <Xgates> say I need to build in firmware R600_rlc.bin into the kernel and wanted to know if these lines look ok?
[17:50] <Xgates> (R600_rlc.bin) External firmware blobs to build into the kernel binary
[17:50] <Xgates> (firmware) Firmware blobs root directory
[17:51] <Xgates> also do I leave this ticked? --->  [ ] Prevent firmware from being built or unmark it so the external firmware blob can be compiled in?
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[17:54] <Xgates> may bad on firmware /path --->  (/lib/firmware/radeon) Firmware blobs root directory
[17:54] <arfon> Well guys, it's almost weekend time, I'm gonna shutdown.  Have a good weekend.
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[17:59] <BP{k}> \o/
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[18:00] Nick change: Guest23275 -> RaNdY
[18:01] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest38728
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[18:03] <Xgates> well if anyone sees this or is breathing I ticked --->  [*] Prevent firmware from being built  and the firmware was built in, so I guess this means other firmware like the kernel-firmware-2.6.33.4-noarch-1 from being built....
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[18:09] <Skywise> wine 1.2 has been released, i think i'll try that
[18:09] <stinky> noice
[18:11] <FriedBob> Skywise: Is that red or white? I sure could use a nice glass of merlot right now.
[18:13] <dustybin> Kentucky Fried Bob
[18:13] <Skywise> i do believe the color is configurable
[18:13] <stinky> hehe
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[18:21] <godane> hey
[18:22] <bitlord> hi
[18:22] <godane> where are the slackware-live scripts?
[18:22] <godane> i think alien was the one that was suppose to make it
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[18:23] <FriedBob> godane: they owed me money, so I had to kill them after repeated collection attempts failed.
[18:24] <godane> so there are no scripts?
[18:24] Action: stinky the body was.
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[18:35] <godane> FriedBob
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[18:36] <godane> do you have the livecd scripts anywhere?
[18:36] <Skywise> ok i'm not so sure about this wine 1.2 installed
[18:36] <Skywise> er, installer
[18:37] <stinky> i thought they were based off the slax live scripts.
[18:37] <Skywise> i run it as root and it says it to run it as a user, then when you run it as a user it says it needs to su root to build and install wine
[18:37] <stinky> I may be mistaken though.
[18:37] <godane> i thought he was going to be rewriting them
[18:37] <godane> so there it didn't need a system installed or something
[18:38] <stinky> ahh
[18:39] <alienBOB> godane: no I am not going to create a modified linux-live
[18:39] <godane> ok then
[18:39] <bitlord> Skywise, I just tried wine 1.2, using slacky.eu script to build it, and it builds fine, and install, tried as user winecfg
[18:40] <alienBOB> At some point, when I get some time, I want to write a simple script that takes the Slackware DVD and creates a love DVD out of it - for demonstration purposes (for people who want to see what Slackware looks like).
[18:40] <alienBOB> Not a live DVD for daily use
[18:40] <Skywise> oh
[18:40] <Skywise> no one will use it as you intend
[18:40] <alienBOB> You can use linux-live scripts for _that_
[18:41] <alienBOB> I don't care about how people use it, when I have written it. Everyone is free to use it as they see fit
[18:41] <godane> whats this 'love DVD' then?
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[18:41] <shonudo> porn
[18:41] <alienBOB> I meant "live DVD" - the keys are too close together
[18:41] <godane> ok
[18:42] <Skywise> spread some slack love
[18:42] <shonudo> indeed
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[18:43] <shonudo> could a demo dvd like that evolve into a live/install dvd?
[18:44] <godane> i would think a demo dvd is a live dvd
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[18:44] <Skywise> i think he's talking about how with ubuntu you can boot the livecd then commit it to disk if you wanna keep it
[18:45] <Skywise> or even just save setting and files and continue to run from the cd/dvd
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[18:46] <godane> i build a lot of livecds
[18:46] <godane> even the scripts i have build
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[18:47] <riza> Hi, seems like I can't find git in here: http://slackbuilds.org/result/?search=git&sv=13.0
[18:47] <thrice`> riza, ships with slackware :)
[18:47] <godane> got linux-live to be initramfs with mkinitcpio
[18:47] <riza> Doh! Really? What is it called? D:
[18:47] <thrice`> "git"
[18:48] <bitlord> slackpkg search git
[18:49] <riza> It has git! I want a frontend for it!
[18:49] <thrice`> xterm?
[18:49] <shonudo> skywise, yeah, that's what i meant
[18:49] <shonudo> something along those lines
[18:49] <godane> qt frontend qgit
[18:49] <riza> No qgit. D:
[18:49] <riza> Not found, hum.
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[18:53] <riza> Any recommendation tho?
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[18:54] <trhodes> gitk
[18:54] Nick change: troy_ -> troy
[18:54] <thrice`> "front end" doesn't really mean much to me :(  what exactly are you after?
[18:54] <riza> Hm, analogy. iptables is backend. ipkungfu is frontend.
[18:54] <troy> hey guys - anyone know of a reasonable way to get wine working on slackware64?
[18:54] <riza> It's the gui.
[18:54] <troy> for win32, I mean
[18:55] <riza> trhodes, thanks! That works! Just gotta figure out why it says "cannot find repo here" and gtg! :D
[18:55] <troy> I have the compat stuff installed, courtesy of alienBOB's scripts, but haven't yet tried to build a 32bit package or similar
[18:55] <trhodes> riza: man gittutorial
[18:56] Action: riza bows to trhodes & thrice!!
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[18:59] <troy> wine 1.2 was released today, with win64 support... not sure if I really care, but hopefully it means using wine32 on linux64 is easy now :)
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[19:03] <adrien> you'll need multilib anyway
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[19:05] <troy> adrien: I have multilib, was just hoping it made things smoother :)
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[19:13] <adrien> well, prior to that, I'd have put multilib and then wine(32) only
[19:14] (##slackware) Channel ban on *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip* expired.
[19:14] ##slackware: mode change '-b *!*@gateway/web/freenode/ip*' by slackboy!~thongsong@li6-30.members.linode.com
[19:14] <troy> okay, well, I'll try it tonight - there's some, sadly windows-specific software that I need to use to analyse some radar data :/
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[19:37] <troy> aha! http://connie.slackware.com/~alien/slackbuilds/wine/pkg64/13.1/
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[19:38] <troy> this looks like it'd be easy to adapt to -current+1.2final
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[20:05] <laeild> hi all
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[20:12] <riza> Hello.
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[20:23] <ChrisPontius> hrm..
[20:23] <ChrisPontius> I guess THAT didn' twork...
[20:24] <ChrisPontius> ?
[20:24] <ChrisPontius> hrm
[20:24] <Dominian> er.. huh?
[20:24] Action: jg71 hands ChrisPontius his lost terminal
[20:24] <ChrisPontius> nothing.. getting my channels mixed up
[20:24] <jg71> that, too.
[20:25] <BP{k}> Happy Birthday Slackware (http://www.slackware.com/announce/1.0.php)
[20:25] <ChrisPontius> yeah... uhhh I uhhh.. init 6 by accident which I think is.. reboot?
[20:25] <Dominian> doh!
[20:25] <ChrisPontius> tell me about it...
[20:26] Skaperen (~phil@c-76-125-202-149.hsd1.wv.comcast.net) joined ##slackware.
[20:26] <ChrisPontius> grrr hang on channel is all weird..
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[20:26] <ChrisPontius> ahhhh... much better.. not sure what the heck I did that time...
[20:26] <rworkman> IRC client has an IQ test built in?
[20:27] <ChrisPontius> apparently I failed
[20:27] <rworkman> heh
[20:27] <ChrisPontius> :(
[20:27] <jg71> dont get mIRC any fancy ideas...
[20:27] <ChrisPontius> mIRC?
[20:27] <rworkman> Genetics always wins.
[20:27] <ChrisPontius> Yeah, unfortunately, my genetic pool is more like a sewage plant.. I'm afraid to say
[20:27] <Dominian> hahaha
[20:28] <jg71>  s/say/sniff, hahahaha
[20:28] <ChrisPontius> Well, I don't STINK like one.. geeze
[20:28] <jg71> yeah, you know. SCNR and all that.
[20:28] <ChrisPontius> what?
[20:28] <BP{k}> ChrisPontius: your mommy is your sister?
[20:29] <ChrisPontius> heh.. family tree..
[20:29] <ChrisPontius> its more like a pole
[20:29] <Dominian> pfft hahaha.. dear god
[20:29] <Dominian> You some kind of troll now?
[20:29] <ChrisPontius> er.. wait...genetics now I live under a bridge?
[20:29] <Dominian> *HEADDESK*
[20:29] <jg71> sorry, i could only foncuse you further with some puns. instead i think i opt for a cool breeze, heat waves like this one make me long for the next ice age.
[20:30] <ChrisPontius> yah its definitely hotter than hell outside...
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[20:30] <ChrisPontius> 102 earlier today... and that was in the shade..
[20:30] <ChrisPontius> I dont' mow my grass.. I just feed it matches... no point in mowing it
[20:30] <crzyjw> Tru that
[20:30] <jg71> why mow when you can inhale ... ok ok.
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[20:32] <ChrisPontius> hrm.. wasn't there another channel on here.. ... having a hard time finding it
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[20:32] <ChrisPontius> bah oh well figure it out later
[20:32] <Dominian> anotoher channel?  there are a LOT on this network...
[20:33] <ChrisPontius> linux support channel.. sure ##linux
[20:33] <ChrisPontius> but that's not the one I was llookin' for..
[20:33] <Dominian> ahhhhhhh I was going to suggest that one.. ok nevermind then :)
[20:33] <ChrisPontius> heh.. no worries
[20:35] ##slackware: mode change '+o phrag' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[20:35] Topic changed on ##slackware by phrag!phrag@about/slackware/phrag: Channel Guidelines: http://is.gd/bYfOG | Logs: http://is.gd/bYfRK | Stats:  http://phra.gs:8000/ || http://slackbook.org | http://slackwiki.org | http://slackbuilds.org |  http://gallery.slackadelic.com | http://slackware.com/getslack | Torrent: http://is.gd/bYfM0 | Slackware 13.1  Released | Security: bind, mozilla-firefox, mozilla-thunderbird, seamonkey, cups, libtiff, libpng | Happy B
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[20:36] <Dominian> er.. what changed...
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[20:37] Topic changed on ##slackware by phrag!phrag@about/slackware/phrag: Channel Guidelines: http://is.gd/bYfOG | Logs: http://is.gd/bYfRK | Stats:  http://phra.gs:8000/ || http://slackbook.org | http://slackwiki.org | http://slackbuilds.org |  http://gallery.slackadelic.com | http://slackware.com/getslack | Torrent: http://is.gd/bYfM0 | Slackware 13.1  Released | Security: cups, libtiff, libpng | Happy Birthday Slackware! =)
[20:37] <Dominian> hehe
[20:38] ##slackware: mode change '-o phrag' by phrag!~phrag@about/slackware/phrag
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[20:41] <sahko> yeah , still no bind :p
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[20:42] Action: nachox lights some candles
[20:43] <phrag> i passed out some slackware dvds at work today =)
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[20:43] <shonudo> there's a nice way to celebrate a birthday
[20:44] <shonudo> just made me think of something: maybe i'll give everyone i know slackware for christmas... that should stop the phone from ringing in 2011
[20:45] <phrag> ha, it could go either way =P
[20:45] <sahko> nah, it will be ringing more. they'll all be calling you for support
[20:45] <shonudo> lol
[20:45] <shonudo> with the people i know, it'll take most of 2011 for them to figure out it's not a movie
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[21:07] <Buntfu> hi everyone
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[21:23] <hiptobecubic> 64bit wine!
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[21:25] <hiptobecubic> alright... well I'm excited
[21:25] <shonudo> THAT sounded strange
[21:25] <shonudo> usually it's by year
[21:25] <shonudo> and region
[21:25] <shonudo> rarely by bit
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[21:25] <shonudo> when was it released, hiptobecubic?
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[21:31] <troy> today :)
[21:31] <troy> shonudo: hasn't aged much yet
[21:31] <shonudo> ;)
[21:31] <shonudo> just looked it up -- end of May it seems
[21:31] <shonudo> interesting...
[21:32] <troy> hiptobecubic: I'm working on building it right now
[21:32] <hiptobecubic> troy let me know
[21:32] <troy> well, 1.2 final was announced today, I think
[21:32] <jg71> hold your horses, troy.
[21:32] <shonudo> does slack's gcc work with it?
[21:32] <hiptobecubic> my setup hasn't been "building things" lately
[21:32] <troy> jg71: what's wrong with my horses?
[21:32] <jg71> troy: nothing but it makes for a nice pun.
[21:32] Action: troy diliberately misinterprets idioms because it's fun
[21:32] <jg71> ;)
[21:33] <hiptobecubic> how is it a pun?
[21:33] <troy> idiom
[21:33] <hiptobecubic> idiom yes
[21:33] <jg71> it's a 64bit pun. you aint there yet, young 32bit padawan.
[21:34] <hiptobecubic> "hold your horses" is a 64bit pun?
[21:34] <shonudo> that makes twice as less sense
[21:34] <jg71> look, i didnt stark not making sense.
[21:34] <troy> hiptobecubic: maybe refering to horse power of the 64 bit cpu?
[21:34] <troy> hahaha
[21:34] <dcauter> jg71: haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
[21:34] <jg71> ;)
[21:34] <hiptobecubic> perhaps it's referring to "bit" in the horse sense
[21:35] <hiptobecubic> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_(horse)
[21:35] <rob0> Chomping at the 64-bit.
[21:36] <jg71> at least nobody pulled the naughty nibbling reference yet.
[21:36] <shonudo> bridle shower would be more of a pun, no?
[21:36] <jg71> no. you asked correctly. no no no.
[21:37] <rob0> Naaaaay! In a stable environment, perhaps.
[21:37] <shonudo> lol
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[21:40] <rworkman> dcauter: Hi Alan.
[21:41] <troy> alright, building wine 1.2 using -alien-esque buildscript
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[21:57] <hiptobecubic> troy, how is it looking?
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[22:03] <troy> hiptobecubic: well, the compiler is eating my cpu and contributing to the heat death of the universe
[22:04] <troy> hiptobecubic: other than that, no comment yet :)
[22:04] <hiptobecubic> troy, sounds just like the old wine
[22:04] Nick change: Guest8924 -> RaNdY
[22:05] Nick change: bagira__ -> thumbs
[22:05] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest78089
[22:05] <troy> hiptobecubic: well, I'm used to regularly building KDE, so it's not really that big of a deal :)
[22:06] <hiptobecubic> troy, oh you're one of THOSE
[22:06] <troy> hiptobecubic: as in troy@kde.org :P
[22:06] <troy> yes - one of those
[22:07] <hiptobecubic> troy :)
[22:07] Action: troy will have his 10-year anniversary of commit access to KDE in a few weeks - throwing himself a party by randomly committing something :P
[22:07] <hiptobecubic> I guess i can forgive that
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[22:07] ##slackware: mode change '+b *!0@*' by slackboy!~thongsong@li6-30.members.linode.com
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[22:07] <Courtney> wow
[22:08] <Tadgy> Courtney: hey baby
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[22:08] <Courtney> hey!
[22:09] <Courtney> Well, you finally got me  here...
[22:09] <troy> whee! slackers abound! :P
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[22:10] <Tadgy> Courtney: Yeah, now you can fill us in about our favourite stalker :)
[22:10] <troy> Tadgy: is it Pat? :P
[22:10] <Courtney> heh
[22:10] <Tadgy> hehe
[22:10] <Courtney> *giggles*
[22:11] <troy> Tadgy: also, yay for proper spelling of favourite :P
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[22:12] <Xgates> I only run Openbox and I compiled qBittorrent which is a QT app and I'm trying to figure out if there's a way to use Kde themes or is it QT themes for it by hand, like using .gtkrc-2.0 yo can modify by hand to load GTK+ themes...
[22:12] Action: troy shuts up now and watches wine compile
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[22:12] <troy> Xgates: run 'qtconfig'
[22:12] <Tadgy> troy: Hehe, I spell things correctly - given that i'm English :)
[22:13] <Tadgy> Courtney: So hows that restraining order against Mr Punches going?
[22:13] <troy> Tadgy: I spell things Canadian :P which is mostly English except for Aluminum, which we steal from the US :P
[22:13] <Xgates> I'd rather load it by hand like how .gtkrc-2.0 loads gtk+ themes, I'm into staying as lightweight from software as possible, that's why I run OpenBox :)
[22:13] <thrice`> troy, btw, I read an interview that said you're a kubuntu user :>
[22:13] <Xgates> so can't load them by hand?
[22:13] <Tadgy> troy: lol, fair enough :)
[22:13] <troy> thrice`: from... 97?
[22:14] <thrice`> 2007 &
[22:14] <jeev> thrice`, i saw an interview at mcdonalds and they praised you as a great manager
[22:14] <hiptobecubic> troy, did you use the IE_fix patch?
[22:14] <troy> thrice`: err, 2007 :P
[22:14] <Xgates> my bad didn't know I had qtconfig already installed
[22:14] <Xgates> lol
[22:14] Action: Xgates looks
[22:14] <thrice`> yes jeev
[22:14] <thrice`> I got promoted
[22:14] <troy> hiptobecubic: no patches applied at all (yet)
[22:14] <thrice`> FINALLY
[22:14] <jeev> manager of fries bag openings
[22:14] <troy> hiptobecubic: I'll see what needs to happen if things break
[22:14] <gar0t0> Hello
[22:15] <troy> hiptobecubic: or rather, I didn't change anything from alienBOB's buildscript except the version number
[22:15] <hiptobecubic> "NOTE: This patch is *intended* to be REVERSED when applied to the wine source, as we need to *remove* this from the code, or else IE might have problems.  --rworkman (SBo)"
[22:15] <troy> hiptobecubic: old version of wine, right?
[22:15] <hiptobecubic> troy, presumably?
[22:15] <gar0t0> lunch time
[22:15] <gar0t0> cya
[22:15] <Courtney> Tadgy: hmm?
[22:15] <hiptobecubic> 1.1.24 it looks like
[22:16] <troy> hiptobecubic: when new things are released, I try them virgin first before I try to do old patching
[22:16] <troy> this is 1.2.0
[22:16] <troy> otherwise we get into the maintenance issues that drove me away from kubuntu
[22:16] <troy> thrice`: I went to an ubuntu conference, got into a shouting match with shuttleworth about how they were dealing with the KDE community, then retreated back to the comfort of slack
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[22:17] <troy> thrice`: I've also done stints on Mandriva and FreeBSD, as my mood required
[22:17] <thrice`> lol
[22:17] <troy> thrice`: but always slacker at heart
[22:18] <troy> hiptobecubic: other distros have gotten into issues where they're carrying around old patches that still apply cleanly, but break functionality because upstream has fixed the issue in some other part of the codebase
[22:19] Xgates (~Xgates@unaffiliated/xgates) left irc: Quit: Ping Timeout ( 0 Seconds )
[22:19] <troy> but they don't bother to test if the patches are still needed... they just apply them and ship
[22:19] <hiptobecubic> boo on that
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[22:20] Action: troy is hammering all parts of his system right now - cpu, io, network... I love this laptop
[22:20] <shonudo> what do you have, troy?
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[22:22] <hiptobecubic> crabs
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[22:22] Action: troy throws a kde-branded cog at hiptobecubic's head :P
[22:23] <hiptobecubic> <3 xfce4-panel + openbox
[22:23] <troy> shonudo: two year old HP Pavilion tx 2500 series (tablet pc with some guts)
[22:23] <troy> hiptobecubic: if it makes you happy :)
[22:23] <hiptobecubic> it doesn't
[22:23] <hiptobecubic> It's just the least frustrating :)
[22:23] <shonudo> i always wanted a tablet... never into the price or the lack of reliability (according to owners)
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[22:24] <troy> shonudo: it's nice these days - everything but the fingerprint reader and wireless works without configuration... the wireless works fine with either ndiswrapper or broadcom's binary blob
[22:24] <troy> biometrics stuff requires pam, which pat is allergic to
[22:25] j0z (unix@unaffiliated/j0z) left irc: Ping timeout: 265 seconds
[22:25] <shonudo> which version of slack?
[22:25] <troy> so the touchscreen/wacom tablet, etc. all work in X out of the box :)
[22:25] <shonudo> 13.1?
[22:25] <troy> -current, always
[22:25] <troy> which is pretty much 13.1 right now anyway
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[22:25] <shonudo> the wacom worked ot of the box? that is nice
[22:26] <shonudo> took some work to set it up on 12.0
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[22:26] <troy> yeah - it works now - some things could be better configured - for example, X treats it just as a mouse, and doesn't have the evdev stuff setup for pressure sensitivity, etc.
[22:27] <shonudo> have you set up an xorg.conf?
[22:27] <mwalling> Courtney: nice version string your client is presenting...
[22:27] <troy> but since I don't paint with it, I haven't bothered to create an xorg.conf
[22:27] <Courtney> thanks!
[22:27] Action: mwalling raises an eyebrow
[22:27] <Tadgy> Indeed.  It has to be said that my namesake is a complete stalker :)
[22:28] <Tadgy> Err, namesake, nemesis.
[22:28] <Tadgy> hehe, interesting spell check correction there :)
[22:28] <shonudo> troy, might be worth setting up the config file; it is kind of nice to have the pressure sensitivity
[22:28] <troy> shonudo: sure, but I haven't found a use case for it yet :)
[22:29] <troy> shonudo: I don't need it to play Spider :P
[22:29] <shonudo> lol... fair enough
[22:29] <Skywise> does minesweeper run under wine?
[22:29] <troy> shonudo: plus, I'm pushing KDE to get wacom/touchscreen/synaptics/etc. config modules for system settings to compliment their keyboard/mouse/etc. settings
[22:29] <troy> Skywise: I think so, but why?
[22:30] <shonudo> i was about to ask as well...
[22:30] <shonudo> skywise, why minesweeper?
[22:30] <Skywise> its one of the most important apps ms has ever developed
[22:30] Action: troy has a very nice native mines game
[22:30] <hiptobecubic> shonudo, why else would he be using wine?
[22:30] <troy> Skywise: better than MS Bob?
[22:30] <shonudo> LOL!
[22:31] <shonudo> man, Bob... that's a long-forgotten mistake
[22:31] <hiptobecubic> not only does minesweeper work, but i think it is included
[22:31] <Skywise> bob was a product that no one even knew what it was supposed to be
[22:32] <shonudo> including its developers
[22:32] <Skywise> them especially
[22:32] <shonudo> i think it was supposed to be "friendly"
[22:32] <Skywise> how'd they know they were finished
[22:32] <troy> it was actually really cool :)
[22:32] <troy> but totally useless
[22:33] <shonudo> it was toy-like
[22:33] <skycrash> anybody have soft for fingerprint working ?
[22:33] <byteframe> skycrash, ibm?
[22:34] <Skywise> nah, biometrics are a scam
[22:34] <byteframe> Seemed silly to me tolo.
[22:34] <byteframe> too*
[22:34] <alisonken1home> tolo sounded better :)
[22:34] <Skywise> they have 2 primary flaws, 1 is they're primarily just imagers of some sort that can be fooled, and 2nd you can't issue someone a new retina if their credentials are forged
[22:34] <byteframe> I'm way gone.
[22:35] Courtney (~seven@bakusaiga.trekweb.org) left irc: Quit: Chris is right outside the door.. I have to get the police and hide!
[22:35] <byteframe> Oh no.
[22:36] <byteframe> Oh lordy.
[22:36] <byteframe> cpunch coutrney man-boy love weirdo shiz.
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[22:36] <alisonken1home> byteframe: where?
[22:36] <Skywise> some things are better left unsaid
[22:37] <alisonken1home> heh
[22:37] <byteframe> alisonken1home, I'me sure I lost the URL, but it would explain it.
[22:37] <byteframe> si si,.
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[22:37] <troy> I didn't see mines.exe in the wine build list :/
[22:37] <alisonken1home> just asking because cpunches has been a pain
[22:38] <byteframe> alisonken1home, ok, there was this site made by him that was all about how he WASNT stalking this girl, she was, and you could tell it was him replying to himself as other 'friends'...
[22:38] <Skywise> what? i was gonna nominate him for man of the year
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[22:38] <byteframe> etc
[22:38] <alisonken1home> ah - another option for him then
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[22:38] <SmartOne2> here me back from the isrri
[22:39] <SmartOne> ya SmartOne2 you are now talking.This is your desktop computer.
[22:39] <SmartOne2> Oh I see this is the laptop
[22:39] <shonudo> the WINE app list is an odd assortment...
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[22:40] godane (~arch@c-75-68-6-221.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) joined ##slackware.
[22:41] <godane> i found your source cod alien
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[22:41] <shonudo> is source cod anything like bacalao?
[22:41] <godane> *alienBOB
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[22:43] <shonudo> troy, if you ever decide to enable the pressure function of the wacom, check out mypaint
[22:44] Action: troy found his first issue with the wine buildscript - it compiled fine, then failed when the buildscript expected a file there that no longer exists
[22:44] <troy> damnit!
[22:44] <hiptobecubic> troy, which?
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[22:46] <troy> winemenuedit.xpm
[22:47] <troy> it was an icon that slackware was borrowing for the app menu entry
[22:47] <troy> I'm just skipping that line and rerunning the build
[22:47] Action: fire|bird handcuffs raela and gives her to rob0
[22:48] <mwalling> hahahahaha
[22:48] <raela> ...well um
[22:48] <rob0> thanks fire|bird
[22:48] <Tadgy> rob0: Just be sure to share her around with the group :)
[22:48] <rob0> but I don't know what to do with this
[22:48] <raela> let me free?
[22:48] <raela> if I love you, I'll come back
[22:49] Action: rob0 lets raela free
[22:49] <Tadgy> If you love me, you'll gargle love :)
[22:49] Action: troy wonders the weird logic of irc
[22:49] Action: raela runs the hell away
[22:49] <rob0> sorry fire|bird
[22:49] <fire|bird> rob0, haha
[22:49] <BP{k}> troy: wait irc has logic? ;-)
[22:49] <raela> Tadgy: gargle love and blood? sounds good to me
[22:49] <troy> BP{k}: yes, it's internally self-consistent
[22:49] <troy> BP{k}: just really strange :)
[22:51] <BP{k}> "IRC is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." (orginally written in 1992 with regards to usenet. but applicable) :)
[22:51] Action: troy has been on openprojects/freenode for far too long now - I'm getting tired, like butter spread too thin... I want to see mountains, again gandalf... mountains...
[22:51] <jeev> anyone use reverse tunneling on SSH ? it's pissing me off
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[22:52] <rob0> raela will be back, mark my words. Sometime raela is going to want help with the access point or something.
[22:52] Action: troy only uses forward tunneling - to punch through the telco's bittorrent throttling
[22:52] <alisonken1home> BP{k}: yep - some of the best classics never get old :)
[22:52] <raela> rob0: true.. it connects now, but if I ever want to try bridging.. though really that should be a huge RTFM to me
[22:53] <hiptobecubic> jeev, how so?
[22:53] <rob0> I once used Lincoln tunnelling to get out of Manhattan.
[22:53] <synyster> lol
[22:54] pizzledizzle (~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) left irc: 
[22:54] <shonudo> lol
[22:55] <shonudo> rob0, did you take the tunnel gooing in reverse?
[22:56] <jeev> i'm trying to make it listen on all interfaces at least but it keeps pulling it up on 127.0.0.1
[22:56] <shonudo> (if so, pics please)
[22:56] <jeev> i figured it out once but i cant now
[22:56] <shonudo> jeev, can you make it listen to anything other than home?
[22:56] <rob0> jeev: GatewayPorts in sshd_config(5)
[22:57] <panzer> rob0: gots me some alpine working.
[22:57] <rob0> shonudo: that would be scary indeed, to all concerned.
[22:57] <shonudo> yeah, it would
[22:57] <shonudo> hate that perpetual curve; can't imagine it in reverse
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[22:58] <shonudo> rob0, now that i think about it, it actually surprises me that nothing catastrophic has ever happened in that tunnel
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[22:59] <rob0> panzer, cool.
[23:00] <panzer> rob0: yea goign to take some getting used to.
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[23:00] <jeev> rob0, thanks, cant get it going though, in pfsense hmm
[23:01] <jeev> tried with -g too
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[23:01] <bikcmp> w73
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[23:03] <jeev> i tried clientspecified too
[23:04] <jeev> [bindaddress]:port:localhost:port does'nt even work
[23:04] <jeev> bah
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[23:06] Nick change: Guest78089 -> RaNdY
[23:06] Nick change: RaNdY -> Guest39917
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[23:07] <jeev> stupid sshd isn't even restarting
[23:08] <jeev> there, thanks rob
[23:08] <rob0> yw
[23:09] MLanden (~MLanden@pool-141-152-182-167.norf.east.verizon.net) joined ##slackware.
[23:09] <MLanden> heya,folks
[23:09] <shonudo> hey MLanden
[23:09] <MLanden> heya, shonudo
[23:09] <shonudo> (had that ready when i saw you log on -- lol)
[23:10] <MLanden> shonudo: cool
[23:10] <shonudo> you've got me doing it
[23:10] <shonudo> what's up?
[23:10] <MLanden> just keepin' cool...or tryin'
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[23:11] <fatalnix> pop the wumpus!
[23:11] <fatalnix> What's up.
[23:11] <shonudo> MLanden, are you on the east coast?
[23:11] efraim_ (~efraim@201-92-78-154.dsl.telesp.net.br) joined ##slackware.
[23:12] <MLanden> shonudo: yeah...east VA
[23:12] <shonudo> what's with that heatwave? you guys are getting hammered
[23:13] <shonudo> or were... it may have passed
[23:13] Nick change: efraim_ -> efraimmarcatto
[23:13] <MLanden> brutal....starts humming Blind Melon
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[23:14] <fatalnix> VA? man! is it true everyone looks the same in West VA?
[23:15] <Skywise> no, they're just related
[23:15] <fatalnix> my roommate was a sick minded man sorry
[23:15] <shonudo> saw that coming
[23:15] <fatalnix> haha
[23:15] <raela> fatalnix: WV and VA are different
[23:15] <fatalnix> yeah I know someone in WV
[23:15] <fatalnix> they seem crazy
[23:16] <Skywise> when wva wanted to secceed from va, va said be my guest
[23:16] <fatalnix> lol
[23:16] <MLanden> lol...mountains and foothills and stuff....oh yeah...elevation as well...big difference
[23:16] <fatalnix> explains a lot
[23:16] Action: fatalnix gasps
[23:16] <fatalnix> AND the wumpus! don't forget the valley wumpus!
[23:17] <shonudo> pretty country, from what i remember, except for the strip-mined stuff
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[23:17] <fatalnix> I had sugar
[23:17] <Skywise> the strip mining is rediculous
[23:17] <shonudo> MLanden, has that changed?
[23:17] <Skywise> they're literally taking the tops off mountains
[23:17] <fatalnix> wow.
[23:17] <shonudo> it's really obvious too
[23:18] <fatalnix> well, the good news is , At least they aren't running around all of VA like angry beavers and killing dogs.
[23:18] <fatalnix> and people
[23:18] <MLanden> shonudo: dunno...that's the other side of the state...overfishing and coastal topics are more relevant
[23:18] <fatalnix> don't forget the people
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[23:19] <shonudo> MLanden, coastal sounds nice
[23:19] <motaro> Has anyone seen Zeitgeist?
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[23:19] <MLanden> anybody try latest wine 1.2?
[23:20] <shonudo> that came up earlier
[23:20] <shonudo> i think troy is building it
[23:20] <Skywise> the thing with wva is the water that isn't polluted by the mining industry gets polluted by the lumber industry or the paper mills
[23:20] <Skywise> the potomac used to be toxic  from it
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[23:26] <hiptobecubic> troy, how long did it take to build and on what? mine is still going.. :$
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[23:30] <thumbs> motaro: yes
[23:31] Cann0n (~jack@unaffiliated/cann0n) left irc: Quit: Lost terminal
[23:32] <motaro> thumbs: have you seen the second part Addendum?
[23:32] <thumbs> motaro: not yet
[23:33] <motaro> It's like completion you should see it. It propose a Utopian society, although they don't really say how to get there though.
[23:34] <rworkman> alan`: Hi Alan.
[23:34] <rworkman> dcauter: Hi Alan.
[23:35] <Tadgy> lol
[23:35] <Tadgy> Chris Punches is still stalking eh?
[23:35] <Dominian> alan`: hi alan
[23:35] <Dominian> dcauter: hi alan
[23:35] <Tadgy> Stalking by proxy :)
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[23:36] <Tadgy> Hey, he could try that with Courtney...
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[23:36] <Tadgy> Wouldn't voilate the restraining order then!
[23:36] <motaro> Have a good night everybody
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[23:37] Nick change: am0rph1s -> am0rphis
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[23:40] <troy> hiptobecubic: rebuilding - problem with the slackbuild script - compilation was fine (but gotta test the thing top-to-bottom so it's reproduceable)
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[23:40] <troy> hiptobecubic: about 90 minutes to build on my two year old dual-core laptop thingy
[23:41] <troy> hiptobecubic: less time that Qt takes anyway :P
[23:41] <hiptobecubic> troy, yeah mine just finished... looks like it built, what problem did you have
[23:41] <MLanden> troy: any parameter with wine 1.2 to take account of(in configure that is) ?
[23:41] <troy> hiptobecubic: using alienBOB's script - the slackbuild failed when looking for an xpm file that is no longer there
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[23:42] <hiptobecubic> troy, oh yes, i noticed your comment earlier and commented it out
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[23:42] <troy> MLanden: *shrug* - using this: http://connie.slackware.com/~alien/slackbuilds/wine/build/
[23:42] <troy> hiptobecubic: aha! then you're faster at compiling than I :)
[23:43] <hiptobecubic> :D
[23:43] <MLanden> troy: ok
[23:44] <troy> MLanden: modified for version number update, and do comment out the line copying the xpm file
[23:45] <MLanden> troy: ok...thanks
[23:45] <fatalnix> Oh, I never got this working but long ago I was working on getting something to run in an initrd, a music file from amp or mpg321, before the root filesystem was even mounted, now that It's been a few years I'd like to look into it again, it is possible if you get the right libraries and all, right?
[23:45] <fatalnix> and load the alsa modules early hand, etc
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[23:46] <Xgates> hey guys
[23:46] <andarius> greetings and salutations
[23:46] <troy> Xgates: you're back!
[23:46] <Xgates> say anyone using any of the Konrad/xen patched for Radeon?
[23:46] <Xgates> http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenPVOPSDRM
[23:47] <Xgates> when using KMS I'm getting this in dmesg: KMS: Radeon [drm:r600_ring_test] *ERROR* radeon: ring test failed (scratch(0x8504)=0xCAFEDEAD)
[23:47] <Xgates> suppose to be those patches to fix that
[23:48] Action: troy has no idea - doesn't futz with his graphics drivers anymore
[23:49] <Dominian> r/12
[23:49] <Xgates> it says this for getting it in git:  http://pastebin.com/mhwAjJDX
[23:49] <MLanden> greeting,andarius
[23:50] <Xgates> I've only used git once so would I run #3 in pastebin or #7?
[23:50] <shonudo> hey andarius
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[23:53] <Xgates> if I'm trying to download off this git:
[23:53] <Xgates> git://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/konrad/xen.git branch devel/kms.fixes-0.3
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[23:54] <Xgates> would I run it like this ---> git clone git://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/konrad/xen.git
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[23:54] <lobito> how can I connect to internet with the ethernet cable?
[23:54] <lobito> I just installed Slackware 13.1
[23:54] <lobito> please help x3 x3 x3 !! ^^
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[23:56] <Xgates> lobito: if you're hardware is supported and you set up to use dhcp you just plug in the cable and you should be online automatically that's all
[23:57] <Xgates> if you didn't set it up during install then run now as root ---> netconfig
[23:58] <lobito> sudo netconfig?
[23:58] <Xgates> no
[23:58] <Xgates> su
[23:58] <Xgates> then type the root password
[23:58] <lobito> it says command not found
[23:59] <Xgates> type su then hit enter
[23:59] <Xgates> sar@slackware:~$ su
[23:59] <Xgates> Password:
[23:59] <lobito> yey
[23:59] <lobito> now it worked
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[23:59] <Xgates> now type ---> netconfig
[23:59] <lobito> already
[23:59] <lobito> hostname?
[00:00] --- Sat Jul 17 2010